<html><body><div style="color:#000; background-color:#fff; font-family:HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif;font-size:10pt"><div class="" style=""><span class="" style="">Hi everyone</span></div><div class="" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 13.63636302947998px; font-family: HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif; font-style: normal; background-color: transparent;"><span class="" style=""><br class="" style=""></span></div><div class="" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 13.63636302947998px; font-family: HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif; font-style: normal; background-color: transparent;">Back in February 2010, I sent Mike Collinson an email to set up this list.</div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 13.63636302947998px; font-family: HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif;
font-style: normal; background-color: transparent;" class=""><span class="" style=""><br style="font-family: 'Helvetica Neue', 'Segoe UI', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif; font-size: 12.727272033691406px;" class=""><span style="font-family: 'Helvetica Neue', 'Segoe UI', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif; font-size: 12.727272033691406px;" class="">> At 04:47 PM 24/02/2010, Mikel Maron wrote:</span></span></div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 12.727272033691406px; font-family: 'Helvetica Neue', 'Segoe UI', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif; font-style: normal; background-color: transparent;" class=""><span style="font-size: 10pt;" class="">> Mike</span></div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 10pt; font-style: normal; background-color: transparent;" class=""><span style="font-size: 10pt;" class=""><font face="Helvetica Neue, Segoe UI, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif" class=""
style="">> </font></span><span style="font-family: HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif; font-size: 10pt;" class="">We have a need for a list just focused on Humanitarian OSM Team ... can you set that up?</span></div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 13.63636302947998px; font-style: normal; font-family: 'Helvetica Neue', 'Segoe UI', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif; background-color: transparent;" class=""><span style="font-size: 10pt;" class="">> hot@openstreetmap.org is what we're thinking.</span></div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 10pt; font-style: normal; background-color: transparent;" class=""><span style="font-size: 10pt;" class=""><font face="Helvetica Neue, Segoe UI, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif" class="" style="">> </font></span><span style="font-family: HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif;
font-size: 10pt;" class="">Thanks</span></div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 13.63636302947998px; font-style: normal; font-family: 'Helvetica Neue', 'Segoe UI', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif; background-color: transparent;" class=""><span style="font-size: 10pt;" class="">> Mikel</span></div><div class="" style=""></div><div class="" style=""> </div><div class="" style=""><span style="font-size: 10pt;" class="">We think this has worked out pretty well, right? :) This was after a tremendous amount of community activity and consideration.</span></div><div class="" style=""><br class="" style=""></div><div class="" style="">The idea of hot-francophone raises a lot of questions, that deserve the time for us as a community to consider.</div><div class="" style=""><br class="" style=""></div><div class="" style="">* Do we envision every language group working within HOT to set up its own language list? hot-indonesian?
hot-philippines?</div><div class="" style="">* How would local language HOT lists interact with country level lists?</div><div class="" style=""><span style="font-size: 10pt;" class="">* How would coordination and communication between mailing lists be managed?</span><br class="" style=""></div><div class="" style=""><span style="font-size: 10pt;" class=""><div class="" style="">* Are we in danger of having only French speakers involved in HOT activities in Francophone countries?</div></span></div><div class="" style="">* Are there other alternatives to consider again, that we've used ok in the past, like the practice of including Google Translations in posts?</div><div class="" style=""><div class="" style=""><br class="" style=""></div><div class="" style="">We should discuss these things together. No matter what your native language, there's something to consider here. Let's get together and talk and come to consensus about the best way forward. I
call on someone to organize an IRC meeting next week, perhaps as a meeting of the Communication Working Group. Providing these forums for our collective discussion and decision making is part of what HOT does.</div><div class="" style=""><br class="" style=""></div><div class="" style="">Which, like all Working Groups, is open to everyone in the HOT community. Please, we need you!</div><div class="" style=""><br class="" style=""></div><div class="" style=""><span style="font-size: 10pt;" class="">And about OSM mailing lists, from my 9 years experience in the project, I don't think we have a precedent to hot-francophone. All OSM mailing lists come out of community discussion. </span><span style="font-size: 10pt;" class="">We're still lacking that discussion regarding HOT communication channels. </span><span style="font-size: 10pt;" class="">If you look over the lists at </span><a href="https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo" class=""
style="font-size: 10pt; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);">https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo</a><span style="font-size: 10pt;" class="">, they fall into two broad categories: locations and topical lists. The locations lists have sometimes sub-divided into finer grained locations, like oxoncotwsalds. But key to this, that came out of a discussion among the existing community. And there was a precedent of local area lists --- it makes natural sense to split up by geography. Language splits among topical lists is another issue, and something we need to think about. </span><span style="font-size: 10pt;" class="">And important to note, OSM mailing lists are famously difficult. talk@ is really no model for productive discussion.</span></div><div class="" style=""><span style="font-size: 10pt;" class=""><br class="" style=""></span></div><div class="" style="">-Mikel</div><div class="" style=""><br class="" style=""></div></div><div class=""
style="">* Mikel Maron * +14152835207 @mikel s:mikelmaron</div> <div class="qtdSeparateBR"><br><br></div><div class="yahoo_quoted" style="display: block;"> <div style="font-family: HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif; font-size: 10pt;" class=""> <div style="font-family: HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt;" class=""> <div dir="ltr" class="" style=""> <font size="2" face="Arial" class="" style=""> On Friday, July 11, 2014 12:04 PM, Harry Wood <mail@harrywood.co.uk> wrote:<br class="" style=""> </font> </div> <blockquote style="border-left: 2px solid rgb(16, 16, 255); margin-left: 5px; margin-top: 5px; padding-left: 5px;" class=""> <br class="" style=""><br class="" style=""> <div class="" style="">Thanks for bringing this back on topic Mark.<br clear="none" class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style="">Given that the HOT mailing list has been
the primary communication channel for HOTties (volunteers/members/whoever) it's a fairly big change introduce a language split like this.<br clear="none" class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style="">So the new mailing list is here:<br clear="none" class="" style=""><a shape="rect" href="https://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/hot-francophone/" target="_blank" class="" style="">https://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/hot-francophone/</a><br clear="none" class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style="">Does help or hinder us?<br clear="none" class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style="">Raphael said it seems like a "natural" move, and I guess that's why sev just went ahead and did it. I don't really want to heap criticism on Sev for doing that. And I don't think Heather wanted to do either. She was merely saying we (all of us) should've had a discussion<br clear="none" class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style="">I
worry that we seem to be developing some deep divides in our community between english and french speakers. So yeah it's a tricky one. Obviously if you speak french and not english... it's natural to want a french mailing list to post to.<br clear="none" class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style="">I'm kind of 50/50 on it really. "Swings and roundabouts" to use an awkward english phrase :-)<br clear="none" class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style="">Harry<br clear="none" class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""><div class="" id="yqtfd67520" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style="">-----<br clear="none" class="" style="">From: Mark Cupitt <<a shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:markcupitt@gmail.com" href="mailto:markcupitt@gmail.com" class="" style="">markcupitt@gmail.com</a>><br clear="none" class="" style="">To: Severin Menard <<a shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:severin.menard@gmail.com"
href="mailto:severin.menard@gmail.com" class="" style="">severin.menard@gmail.com</a>> <br clear="none" class="" style="">Cc: "<a shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:hot@openstreetmap.org" href="mailto:hot@openstreetmap.org" class="" style="">hot@openstreetmap.org</a>" <<a shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:hot@openstreetmap.org" href="mailto:hot@openstreetmap.org" class="" style="">hot@openstreetmap.org</a>> <br clear="none" class="" style="">Sent: Friday, 11 July 2014, 16:27<br clear="none" class="" style="">Subject: Re: [HOT] Launching the hot mailing list in French<br clear="none" class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style="">Hey All, I live in an environment where there are German, Swiss, French, Aussie, Us, Britts, Belgian, US speakers (to name a few). <br clear="none" class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style="">One of the simple things I have learnt is that to communicate, someone has to translate. And that is no
simple task .. I speak Aussie .and I am lucky that folks take the time to explain what is being said.<br clear="none" class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style="">So, I am all for multi-lingual lists, however, how do the points that are made on each list get communicated to the other lists?<br clear="none" class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style="">Its all well and dandy to have them, but at the end of the day, we need to share the information...<br clear="none" class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style="">How do we do that across different lists in different languages ..<br clear="none" class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style="">Cheers<br clear="none" class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style="">Regards<br clear="none" class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style="">Mark Cupitt<br clear="none" class="" style=""><br clear="none"
class="" style="">_______________________________________________<br clear="none" class="" style="">HOT mailing list<br clear="none" class="" style=""><a shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:HOT@openstreetmap.org" href="mailto:HOT@openstreetmap.org" class="" style="">HOT@openstreetmap.org</a><br clear="none" class="" style=""><a shape="rect" href="https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/hot" target="_blank" class="" style="">https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/hot</a></div><br class="" style=""><br class="" style=""></div> </blockquote> </div> </div> </div> </div></body></html>