<div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr">Hi Nate,</div><div dir="ltr"><br><div>I'm one of the three guys actively doing the import as zzptichka_import. I didn't write the wiki and joined the import once it started but so far it's been going fairly well IMO.</div><div>If you go back a couple of months into this list archive you'll see the discussion of this import. There has been discussion of this import on the osm-ca channel as well. </div><div>Data, at least in Toronto is of very good quality. Some buildings (only in some parts of Toronto) have overlapping 3D features that need to be dealt with and we've discussed that on slack chats in details once we've come across this in Toronto. I agree that needs to be added to the wiki.</div><div><br></div><div>As for your specific concerns, </div><div><br></div><div>1) There was a discussion going on in the import list (starting with Ottawa import a year ago) and in the slack channel. If you have any concerns let's talk.</div><div><br></div><div>2) Overlapping buildings in this particular example is what you get with aforementioned 3D features. It had to be dealt with, we've discussed that with DannyMcD. I agree this is not acceptable and he'll have to go back and re-validate those (as far as I can see there are not many errors like these). You can go through 300000 buildings imported by me and won't find anything like that: <a href="https://osmcha.mapbox.com/?filters=%7B">https://osmcha.mapbox.com/?filters=%7B</a>"users"%3A%5B%7B"label"%3A"zzptichka_import"%2C"value"%3A"zzptichka_import"%7D%5D%2C"date__gte"%3A%5B%7B"label"%3A""%2C"value"%3A""%7D%5D%7D</div><div><br></div><div>3) Task manager doesn't allow to split squares further unfortunately. However, as someone who has done multiple of those squares over last couple of weeks I can tell you with JOSM hotkeys and filters it's fairly easy to do. Typically it takes me no more that 1 hour to validate dense square with ~5000 buildings and fix several dozen other building and highway-related JOSM warnings (Toronto unfortunately has rather poor OSM quality)</div><div><br></div><div>4) Task Manager instructions page (that I've edited) clearly requests to validate and fix all building-related errors and warnings. Can't say for DannyMcD(who I know as a very meticulous mapper) and carpbunker but I follow this process religiously.</div><div><br></div><div>5) Again, instructions page request to use "Replace geometry" when possible. I'll see if I can add this to the wiki page if it's not there. As for me, I ALWAYS us "Replace geometry" on buildings that have any meaningful tags. I only delete existing buildings when I come across a cluster of roughly drawn shapes with the only generic "building=yes" tag. Executing replace geometry for each pair of those buildings would be insanely time-consuming. If you know of any better solution please let me know.</div><div><br></div><div>Thanks for flagging issues with the import. I'll ask guys to stop importing and address the raised concerns and resume only after everything has been dealt with.</div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><br></div></div></div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr">On Thu, Jan 17, 2019 at 10:30 AM Nate Wessel <<a href="mailto:bike756@gmail.com" target="_blank">bike756@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<div bgcolor="#FFFFFF">
<p>I just learned yesterday of a very large import of buildings
across Canada that seems to have been posted to this list in
November without getting much of a response. I remember seeing the
email about it at the time, and as there was substantial reference
to an import in Ottawa, I thought the import was limited to that
city and failed to read the actual details of the proposal. This
appears to be an import of building footprints across ALL MAJOR
CANADIAN CITIES. <br>
</p>
<p><a class="gmail-m_6470399580875776210m_7993682208788469973gmail-m_5252427456289761864moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/WikiProject_Canada/Canada_Stats_Canada_Building_Outlines_Import/Plan" target="_blank">https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/WikiProject_Canada/Canada_Stats_Canada_Building_Outlines_Import/Plan</a><br>
</p>
<p><a class="gmail-m_6470399580875776210m_7993682208788469973gmail-m_5252427456289761864moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/imports/2018-November/005812.html" target="_blank">https://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/imports/2018-November/005812.html</a></p>
<p>This is being imported NOW, very quickly, and the data I've seen
in Toronto is of dubious quality at best. Given the speed with
which this has taken place and the lack of clear discussion about
what exactly the import is, what exactly it covers, I would like
to see this import effort halted immediately if not reverted. <br>
</p>
<p>My concerns are as follows:</p>
<p>1. I'm a very active mapper living and editing in Toronto and
subscribed to the relevant lists and slack channels, yet I only
just learned of this when the buildings encroached on my own
neighborhood. I imagine many others also missed the notice and
have not had any chance to review the plan.<br>
</p>
<p>2. There are countless examples of truly terrible data quality,
weird footprints, overlapping buildings, wildly unsimplified
geometries, etc. e.g. <br>
<a class="gmail-m_6470399580875776210m_7993682208788469973gmail-m_5252427456289761864moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/663824488" target="_blank">https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/663824488</a><br>
<a class="gmail-m_6470399580875776210m_7993682208788469973gmail-m_5252427456289761864moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/662764169" target="_blank">https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/662764169</a><br>
etc. <br>
These issues clearly fail in a simple JOSM validation, which
indicated that no validation is happening before upload.<br>
</p>
<p>3. The data is being imported in extremely large chunks, (see the
tasking manager grid for Ontario:
<a class="gmail-m_6470399580875776210m_7993682208788469973gmail-m_5252427456289761864moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://tasks.osmcanada.ca/project/145" target="_blank">http://tasks.osmcanada.ca/project/145</a>), much larger I think than
any one person could validate or review in a single sitting. There
are more than ten thousand buildings in some of these grid cells.
As changesets are limited to 10k objects, including nodes, it is
extremely difficult to see what data was there before these
changes, as each task involves multiple essentially simultaneous
changesets. <br>
</p>
<p>4. The approach seems to be import first, validate second (if
ever?). <br>
</p>
<p>5. The wiki plan gives no clear description of the plan for
integrating new data with old. In places where there used to be
user-contributed buildings, I now see buildings from this import
covering or replacing those buildings with no remaining way
history. I don't think I need to say that this is completely
unacceptable. <br>
</p>
<p>What are the options on the table here? There has been a truly
massive amount of data imported in the last couple of weeks. I'd
love to wind back time and criticize the living hell out of this
plan before it started, but that's not where we're at. What can be
done?<br>
</p>
<p>:-(<br>
</p>
<div class="gmail-m_6470399580875776210m_7993682208788469973gmail-m_5252427456289761864moz-signature">-- <br>
Nate Wessel<br>
<span style="font-size:10px;color:rgb(119,119,119)">Jack of all trades, Master
of Geography, PhD candidate in Urban Planning<br>
<a href="http://natewessel.com" target="_blank">NateWessel.com</a></span>
<br>
<br>
</div>
</div>
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</blockquote></div><br clear="all"><div><br></div>-- <br><div dir="ltr" class="gmail-m_6470399580875776210m_7993682208788469973gmail_signature"><div dir="ltr">Best Regards,<br> Yaro Shkvorets</div></div></div></div></div></div>