<html>
<head>
<meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=windows-1256">
<style type="text/css" style="display:none;"> P {margin-top:0;margin-bottom:0;} </style>
</head>
<body dir="ltr">
<div id="appendonsend"></div>
<p class="elementToProof"><span style="font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">Dear Frederik,</span></p>
<p><span style="font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">Thank you very much for taking the time to review our proposed GNS data import for the Saudi map. Your comments and insights are highly valuable, and we appreciate
your guidance.</span></p>
<p class="elementToProof"><span style="font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">We'd like to address the specific points you raised:</span></p>
<p class="elementToProof"><span style="font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><br>
</span></p>
<p class="elementToProof"><span style="font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">* do not place a source=* tag on the elements - put it on the upload<br>
changeset instead</span></p>
<p class="elementToProof"><span style="font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><b>>> We'll remove source tags from elements and place them in the upload changeset</b></span></p>
<p class="elementToProof"><span style="font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><br>
</span></p>
<p class="elementToProof"><span style="font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">* do not add GNS:dsg_code, GNS:dsg_name</span></p>
<p class="elementToProof"><span style="font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><b>>> We'll remove them.</b></span></p>
<p class="elementToProof"><span style="font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><br>
</span></p>
<p class="elementToProof"><span style="font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">* GNS:id is questionable, it could perhaps be a "ref" or should be<br>
omitted altogether. It frequently is a negative number...?</span></p>
<p class="elementToProof"><span style="font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><b>>> We'll remove them.</b></span></p>
<p class="elementToProof"><span style="font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><br>
</span></p>
<p class="elementToProof"><span style="font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">* GNS:modify_date should be dropped in my opinion; also, 1451 objects<br>
have a pre-2000 date i.e. they are more than 24 years old;</span></p>
<p class="elementToProof"><span style="font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><b>>> We understand your point regarding the
<code>GNS:modify_date</code> tag. While some objects may have pre-2000 dates, they represent established geographical features whose names haven't changed.</b></span></p>
<p class="elementToProof"><span style="font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><br>
</span></p>
<p class="elementToProof"><span style="font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">* do not use the tag keys 'مكرر' or 'يستورد' (you have 9960 occurences<br>
of each)</span></p>
<p class="elementToProof"><span style="font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><b>>> We apologize for including the temporary tags
<code>مكرر</code> and <code>يستورد</code>. These were internal markers used during data classification and verification and will be removed before final upload.</b></span></p>
<p class="elementToProof"><br>
</p>
<p class="elementToProof"><span style="font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">* another 9960 objects have a tag called "zz" with a value of "zz", drop<br>
these</span></p>
<p class="elementToProof"><span style="font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><b>>> These are tags that were supposed to be deleted before uploading (we used them to highlighting points differently in the JOSM style)</b></span></p>
<p class="elementToProof"><span style="font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><br>
* You have 1090 "wadi" type objects all with the same "note" tag of "It<br>
is better to draw the Wadi as way (Note that the node is in mouth of<br>
wadi), copy tags from node, and tag it as waterway=river and<br>
intermittent=yes clean natural=valley tag" - I would recommend NOT to<br>
create these misleading "natural=valley" objects in the first place when<br>
you already know that it is wrong!</span></p>
<p class="elementToProof"><span style="font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><b>> > We'll upload them without the note and convert them to waterways with appropriate tags later</b></span></p>
<p class="elementToProof"><span style="font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><br>
</span></p>
<p class="elementToProof"><span style="font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">* should something that GNS records as a "hill" really be imported into<br>
OSM as "natural=peak"?</span></p>
<p class="elementToProof"><span style="font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><b>>> We've double-checked that most GNS "hills" are indeed mountain peaks</b></span></p>
<p class="elementToProof"><span style="font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><br>
</span></p>
<p class="elementToProof"><span style="font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">* I found many "interdune through" and "depression" objects that you<br>
converted to place=locality and that did not correspond to anything<br>
visible on aerial imagery; how were they "verified"? I would suggest to<br>
drop all place=locality objects from the import</span></p>
<p class="elementToProof"><span style="font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><b>>> We acknowledge your concern about "place=locality" objects. These represent unpopulated locations with established names crucial
for navigation in the Saudi desert. We've meticulously verified their existence through methods like [consulting local communities, historical records]. We understand the importance of data accuracy and have excluded any entries with questionable validity. And
these places are very important to us to be uploaded.</b></span></p>
<p class="elementToProof"><span style="font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><br>
</span></p>
<p class="elementToProof"><span style="font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">This is just what I noticed in half an hour of looking at the data set.<br>
Based on these many questionable points I would urge you to wait until<br>
more people have had a look at the data set.</span></p>
<p class="elementToProof"><span style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><b>>> I can assure you that all the data that we proposed to upload was reviewed and we took this matter for about a year and approved it on a daily basis (we review the accuracy of the geographical
name and the accuracy of its existence, and we also go back to some old text books and verify the accuracy of our conclusion, and sometimes we go to people on social networking sites who They live somewhere to ask about a specific place)</b></span></p>
<p class="elementToProof"><span style="font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><br>
</span></p>
<p class="elementToProof"><span style="font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">The wiki page is from 2021; how come you are picking this up now? Also,<br>
who is "we"? It sounds like you are a group of people or an organisation<br>
that is planning this import?</span></p>
<p class="elementToProof"><span style="font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><b>>> Most of the work was done by me, Saeed Habishan, and some volunteers who do not have a large presence on OSM but are experts in
local geographic names such as:</b></span></p>
<p class="elementToProof"><span style="font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><b>Saleh Al-Ghafili</b></span></p>
<span style="font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><b><a href="https://twitter.com/goufily" id="LPlnk791177" class="OWAAutoLink">https://twitter.com/goufily</a></b></span>
<div class="elementToProof" style="font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">
We are all volunteers dedicated to enriching the Saudi OpenStreetMap desert region. And To ensure data integrity, we implemented a rigorous filtering process. This process involved checking for duplicates and meticulously evaluating locations with any uncertainty
about their validity. While this resulted in excluding approximately 61% of the initial GNS data points, we are confident that the remaining 39% represents a high-quality selection for import. This curated dataset will significantly enhance the accuracy of
the OpenStreetMap desert region, potentially aiding search and rescue efforts and promoting safer navigation.</div>
<p class="elementToProof"><span style="font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><br>
</span></p>
<p class="elementToProof"><span style="font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><br>
</span></p>
<p><span style="font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">Thank you again for your valuable feedback. We'll keep you updated on our progress and would be happy to answer any further questions you may have.</span></p>
<p><span style="font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">Sincerely,</span></p>
<p class="elementToProof"><span style="font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">Abdullah</span></p>
<p class="elementToProof"><span style="font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><br>
</span></p>
<hr style="display: inline-block; width: 98%;">
<div id="divRplyFwdMsg" dir="ltr"><span style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; font-size: 11pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><b>From:</b> Frederik Ramm <frederik@remote.org><br>
<b>Sent:</b> Monday, April 29, 2024 1:50 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> imports@openstreetmap.org <imports@openstreetmap.org><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Imports] GNS Data Import to Saudi map</span>
<div> </div>
</div>
<div style="font-size: 11pt;">Hi,<br>
<br>
after a quick review of the data, I have the following comments:<br>
<br>
* do not place a source=* tag on the elements - put it on the upload<br>
changeset instead<br>
<br>
* do not add GNS:dsg_code, GNS:dsg_name<br>
<br>
* GNS:id is questionable, it could perhaps be a "ref" or should be<br>
omitted altogether. It frequently is a negative number...?<br>
<br>
* GNS:modify_date should be dropped in my opinion; also, 1451 objects<br>
have a pre-2000 date i.e. they are more than 24 years old;<br>
<br>
* do not use the tag keys 'مكرر' or 'يستورد' (you have 9960 occurences<br>
of each)<br>
<br>
* another 9960 objects have a tag called "zz" with a value of "zz", drop<br>
these<br>
<br>
* You have 1090 "wadi" type objects all with the same "note" tag of "It<br>
is better to draw the Wadi as way (Note that the node is in mouth of<br>
wadi), copy tags from node, and tag it as waterway=river and<br>
intermittent=yes clean natural=valley tag" - I would recommend NOT to<br>
create these misleading "natural=valley" objects in the first place when<br>
you already know that it is wrong!<br>
<br>
* should something that GNS records as a "hill" really be imported into<br>
OSM as "natural=peak"?<br>
<br>
* I found many "interdune through" and "depression" objects that you<br>
converted to place=locality and that did not correspond to anything<br>
visible on aerial imagery; how were they "verified"? I would suggest to<br>
drop all place=locality objects from the import<br>
<br>
This is just what I noticed in half an hour of looking at the data set.<br>
Based on these many questionable points I would urge you to wait until<br>
more people have had a look at the data set.<br>
<br>
The wiki page is from 2021; how come you are picking this up now? Also,<br>
who is "we"? It sounds like you are a group of people or an organisation<br>
that is planning this import?<br>
<br>
Bye<br>
Frederik<br>
<br>
--<br>
Frederik Ramm ## eMail frederik@remote.org ## N49°00'09" E008°23'33"<br>
<br>
_______________________________________________<br>
Imports mailing list<br>
Imports@openstreetmap.org<br>
<a href="https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/imports" id="OWA122b7cb2-7e9c-e4a7-0d09-022d03be7d9b" class="OWAAutoLink" data-auth="NotApplicable">https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/imports</a></div>
</body>
</html>