<div dir="ltr"><div>Hi Christoph,</div><div>I think that there is a premise to your list that I do not quite agree with. ODbL says:</div><div><br></div><div><p style="margin:0px 0px 10px;color:rgb(51,51,51);font-family:"Helvetica Neue",Helvetica,Arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;font-style:normal;font-variant-ligatures:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:400;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;background-color:rgb(255,255,255);text-decoration-style:initial;text-decoration-color:initial">3.1 Subject to the terms and conditions of this License, the Licensor<br>grants to You a worldwide, royalty-free, non-exclusive, terminable (but<br>only under Section 9) license to Use the Database for the duration of<br>any applicable copyright and Database Rights. These rights explicitly<br>include commercial use, and do not exclude any field of endeavour. To<br>the extent possible in the relevant jurisdiction, these rights may be<br>exercised in all media and formats whether now known or created in the<br>future.</p></div><div><br></div><div>So the rights granted are *all* database and copyright rights, subject to certain conditions that apply to Produced Works and Derivative Databases.</div><div>There are rights that are completely not covered by ODbL are trademark and patent rights, which would be #6. <br></div><div>But that also means there is a category #7 you have not listed, where the database and/or copyright rights *are* conveyed by ODbL and no limitations on the exercise of those rights is placed on the user. <br></div><div>So as far as usecases like Matthias's which we are discussing, my opinion is that it is #5, but if it is not, it could be #7. But it could not be #6. <br></div><div><br></div><div><br></div></div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Fri, Dec 13, 2019 at 11:54 AM Christoph Hormann <<a href="mailto:chris_hormann@gmx.de">chris_hormann@gmx.de</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">On Friday 13 December 2019, Frederik Ramm wrote:<br>
><br>
> I had until now assumed that such works would definitely fall under<br>
> the ODbL but you are right, they don't really fit the "Derivative<br>
> Database" definition.<br>
<br>
My reading of the ODbL has always been that something is either<br>
<br>
1) the original Database (or substantial parts of it)<br>
2) a Derivative Database<br>
3) a Collective Database<br>
4) a Produced Work<br>
<br>
or if something is neither of these it would be either<br>
<br>
5) something that is not protected by law at all so free to use<br>
independent of the license terms (like insubstantial extracts of data).<br>
6) something the ODbL does not grant any rights for and therefore cannot<br>
be legally used by the user based on the ODbL.<br>
<br>
So my question would always be if someone considers certain things not<br>
to be a Derivative Database which of the five other above cases applies<br>
instead.<br>
<br>
I would kind of assume that for case (5) there are probably already some<br>
court rulings available for to what extent EU database protection<br>
applies to set operations of different databases since this is nothing<br>
specific to spatial databases but also is relevant for many other types<br>
of data.<br>
<br>
As i already wrote in<br>
<br>
<a href="https://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/talk/2019-November/083535.html" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/talk/2019-November/083535.html</a><br>
<br>
existing OSMF community guidelines suggest spatial operations like<br>
ST_Difference() and ST_Intersection() yield Derivative Databases that<br>
are subject to share-alike.<br>
<br>
--<br>
Christoph Hormann<br>
<a href="http://www.imagico.de/" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.imagico.de/</a><br>
<br>
_______________________________________________<br>
legal-talk mailing list<br>
<a href="mailto:legal-talk@openstreetmap.org" target="_blank">legal-talk@openstreetmap.org</a><br>
<a href="https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/legal-talk" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/legal-talk</a><br>
</blockquote></div>