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Maybe I should admit, I also asked 2 of my friends to join OSMF in
order to grow the community and to get them involved... They both
should have paid yesterday but I told them it is very unlikely they
could vote for this upcoming... election :-D<br>
<br>
I read carefully and with great interest everybody's concerns about the
composition and influence of the board but I hope the personal attacks
could be left off this list as it looks not really good to newcomers
and is pretty annoying anyway. <br>
<br>
Thanks,<br>
Jeroen<br>
<br>
Jim Brown wrote:
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Hi
Peter (and Peter </span><span
style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Wingdings; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">J</span><span
style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">
),<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Thanks
for the comments. I’d like to clarify the
events over the last few weeks for people… And explain why the bump
this week in signups (which I think has been from a wider group than
CloudMade,
but I don’t have access to the lists to know).<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">I
have been encouraging everyone I know, who is interested in
maps, to join OSM and the OSMF. This includes friends, co workers and
suppliers… Over the last week or so a number of people have
indicated to me that they could not join because of either the lack of
a credit
card (in a couple cases) or the inability to authorize a Ukrainian card
in
PayPal (in most cases). I told them they could register with my card
if
needed and that I’d do the transaction for them. I did the
transaction in one go which is why the one day bump.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">I’ve
asked the people to then follow up with Mike C to be
sure the membership records were correct (which I think most of them
have
done). And I reached out to Mike as well to clarify what was going on.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">What
these people do with their membership is up to them.
I have been adament that each time I encourage people to sign up, I
make it
clear that they are to vote exactly as they see fit. I do not, in any
way, direct their vote, nor do I want to know how they vote… What
matters to me is having a strong, healthy organization. <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">I'd
like to add that I completely agree with the comments about
oversight and questioning being important and that a sign of a healthy
community is people caring about things like this – hence my desire for
transparency. And I take no offence at the questioning. I’ve tried
to do what I can to strengthen OSM and OSMF and I’m happy to tell
people
about it.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">I’d
happily discuss this with anyone who wanted to reach
out to me.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: "Arial","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Best
Regards,</span><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: "Arial","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Jim</span><span
style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: "Arial","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Jim
Brown - CTO CloudMade</span><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: "Arial","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">mobile:
+44 (0)7595 367 664</span><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: "Arial","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">email:
<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:jim@cloudmade.com">jim@cloudmade.com</a></span><span
style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: "Arial","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">skype:
jamesbrown_uk</span><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"> </span><span
style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: "Calibri","sans-serif"; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div
style="border-style: solid none none; border-color: rgb(181, 196, 223) -moz-use-text-color -moz-use-text-color; border-width: 1pt medium medium; padding: 3pt 0cm 0cm;">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: "Tahoma","sans-serif";">From:</span></b><span
style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: "Tahoma","sans-serif";">
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:osmf-talk-bounces@openstreetmap.org">osmf-talk-bounces@openstreetmap.org</a>
[<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="mailto:osmf-talk-bounces@openstreetmap.org">mailto:osmf-talk-bounces@openstreetmap.org</a>] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Peter
Miller<br>
<b>Sent:</b> 20 August 2009 07:45<br>
<b>To:</b> Peter Batty<br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:osmf-talk@openstreetmap.org">osmf-talk@openstreetmap.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Osmf-talk] EVERYONE: PLEASE VOTE<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">On 20 Aug 2009, at 06:14, Peter Batty wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">One other brief comment I would make about all
this sudden
alarm at the prospect of Cloudmade having two board members is just to
observe
that this has already been the case for the past year.<o:p></o:p></p>
<blockquote style="margin-top: 5pt; margin-bottom: 5pt;">
<p class="MsoNormal">During this time the OSMF board seems to have
functioned
perfectly well as far as I can see. I am unaware of any inappropriate
behavior
by the board during this time to favor Cloudmade (and if anybody knows
of any
then they should raise the specific concerns that they have). I agree
with
James that it is really inappropriate to suddenly raise such a big fuss
24
hours before the vote closes, when we have already been in the
situation that
is supposedly such a concern for a year, without any apparent problems.<o:p></o:p></p>
</blockquote>
<blockquote style="margin-top: 5pt; margin-bottom: 5pt;">
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">I reiterate that it is my opinion that Nick
and Steve both
have made and will continue to make outstanding contributions as
individuals to
OSMF, and that their company affiliation is incidental to the work they
do in
this regard. I support both of them continuing as board members.<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">In fairness to Frederik the 'alarm' was the
sudden joining
of enough new members who are employed by CM to theoretically change
the
outcome of the election in a major way and I think that was
justified. Frederik has access to list of members because it was him, I
understand, who got the list set up in the first place and until then
there was
no place for members to discuss issues of concern to them with other
members. I
find this list very useful. I don't believe that he has revealed any
personal information so I don't believe the Data Protection Act is a
relevant
issue to raise.<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">I agree that the issue about having more than
one director
from the same company on the board is a separate one that was been
discussed in
the past month on the list with a general view that disclosure was
important
but that a codified limit was not practical or desirable. There is a
live
proposal that we should limit board members from a single company to
40% but it
is not an 'alarming' issue that needs to be raised again at this late
hour.<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">I appreciate Steve's comment that CM, Nick and
him are in 'a
very difficult position and don't always make the right choices'. The
OSMF is a
very young organisation that is having to find its feet very fast and
is doing
so by bumping into issues along the way and resolving them in a typical
messy
human way. What is good is that it is making huge progress.<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">Personally I think we will continue to need
people to being
watching for issues from the outside and 'helping' the organisation
grow up
nice and strong and healthy and that is exactly what seems to be
happening and
something I support.<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">On this particular issue I do strongly advocate
a system
where membership of the foundation can be earned by the 'sweat of the
brow' (ie
sustained contribution to OSM over a period of time) rather than only
with
cash. I believe this would dramatically increase the number of members
(some of
whom might actually vote) and remove the current bias towards the west
and
towards those with spare cash. I raised the question on the foundation
list
last month [1] and there was a useful discussion about it but the view
of a
board member was that it was not an issue that was getting attention.
Possibly
in light of the above it should do. <o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">For the record, I renewed my lapsed membership
last month
and an additional member of ITO's staff joined recently and will, I
understand,
be voting. As a company policy I have provided no guidance to our staff
on
whether to join, whether to vote or who to vote for. I have however put
work into the wiki and on the lists over the past month to ensure that
the
relevant information about candidates is available to all members.<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">My personal view is that we have an excellent
selection of
candidates to choose from and that any combination of 7 of them would
make a
great board.<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">Regards,<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">Peter<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">[1] <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/osmf-talk/2009-August/000131.html">http://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/osmf-talk/2009-August/000131.html</a><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<blockquote style="margin-top: 5pt; margin-bottom: 5pt;">
<p class="MsoNormal"><br clear="all">
<br>
-- <br>
Peter Batty - President, Spatial Networking<br>
W: +1 303 339 0957 M: +1 720 346 3954<br>
Blog: <a moz-do-not-send="true" href="http://geothought.blogspot.com">http://geothought.blogspot.com</a><br>
_______________________________________________<br>
osmf-talk mailing list<br>
<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:osmf-talk@openstreetmap.org">osmf-talk@openstreetmap.org</a><br>
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/osmf-talk">http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/osmf-talk</a><o:p></o:p></p>
</blockquote>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<pre wrap="">
<hr size="4" width="90%">
_______________________________________________
osmf-talk mailing list
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:osmf-talk@openstreetmap.org">osmf-talk@openstreetmap.org</a>
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/osmf-talk">http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/osmf-talk</a>
</pre>
</blockquote>
<br>
<pre class="moz-signature" cols="72">--
Jeroen Carelse
Pappilanniementie 18
13880 Hattula
+358 40 5651956
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.carelse.com">www.carelse.com</a>
</pre>
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