<html><body><div style="color:#000; background-color:#fff; font-family:HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, Sans-Serif;font-size:14px"><div><span>A few points:</span></div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, Sans-Serif; font-size: 14px; font-style: normal; background-color: transparent;"><span><br></span></div><ul><li><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, Sans-Serif; font-size: 14px; font-style: normal; background-color: transparent;"><span>OSM standard is British English. Shopping Centre is standard British English for an enclosed pedestrian space with lots of shops. Historically these have been covered, but this is changing to a simulated street environment (in UK Liverpool One the Arc at Bury St Edmunds are recent examples.</span></div></li><li><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0);
font-family: HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, Sans-Serif; font-size: 14px; font-style: normal; background-color: transparent;"><span>Use of the shop tag is inherently problematic. These are not shops but retail areas. At the moment whenever I do any kind of retail analytical query I have to do AND NOT IN (shop='mall'). I would prefer to use landuse=retail with retail=mall or retail=shopping centre etc. We certainly don't tag a centre of a village with a few shops as shop=village_centre.</span></div></li><li><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, Sans-Serif; font-size: 14px; font-style: normal; background-color: transparent;"><span>shop=mall is more widely used, and although predominantly US English is not likely to be a confusion which shopping centre obviously is from prior posts here. Some of the examples cited would be usually called "Retail Park"
for what I think is typically called a strip mall in the US, and "Shopping Precinct" for a smaller pedestrian area, often with only minor weather protection for shoppers. The latter are dying on their feet in the UK as they cant compete with the "Retail Park" or have a poor selection of shops.</span></div></li><li><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, Sans-Serif; font-size: 14px; font-style: normal; background-color: transparent;"><span>I attempted to provide a fairly detailed typology of these various types of retail area in <a id="ms__id2681" href="http://sk53-osm.blogspot.co.uk/2013/04/segmentation-of-retail-landuse-why-do.html"><font>a blog post</font></a> last summer (hopefully with some useful illustrations). However I think this could be expanded substantially especially with more examples from different countries. See also the typology used by a specialist Retail GIS
Analytics company which features at the start of the blog. Some (largely those featuring the word Parade) may be very UK specific, but most are suitably general. There are also a couple of slides relating to the issue in my SotM-Baltics <a id="ms__id5589" href="http://www.slideshare.net/SK53/gone-shopping-detailed-retail-mapping">presentation</a> (#10 in particular).</span></div></li><li><div class="ms__id2414" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, Sans-Serif; font-size: 14px; font-style: normal; background-color: transparent;"><span>I noticed whilst attending SotM-Baltics last summer that true shopping centres/malls are very common in the main towns in Latvia and Estonia. Presumably they are a favoured way of adding new retail premises. Unfortunately many of these have 3 or more shopping floors and are even harder to map than 2 storey malls.</span></div></li><li><div
class="ms__id2414" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, Sans-Serif; font-size: 14px; font-style: normal; background-color: transparent;"><span>The two main shopping centres in Nottingham have had all the retail outlets mapped. There are many issues as to the best way to map shopping centres/malls but it is clear that if one wants to be accurate about the provision of shops in a town it is essential that this is done. They are also difficult to map because most establishments are access=customers and do not allow photography. </span></div></li><li><div class="ms__id2414" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, Sans-Serif; font-size: 14px; font-style: normal; background-color: transparent;"><span>I mapped an area <a id="ms__id4958" href="http://osm.org/go/ZWs1VV0k-">E of Pittsburgh, PA </a>which has a nice variety of
different kinds of out-of-town retail areas (a mall, Monroeville Mall, several strip malls, smaller areas, numerous car dealers). Unfortunately we don't have active mappers in the area. If anyone can identify a similar location in the US where there are active mappers and useful pictures this would really help sort out the kind of typology we need.</span></div></li></ul><div class="ms__id2414 ms__id4265" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, Sans-Serif; font-size: 14px; font-style: normal; background-color: transparent;"><span>I did start drafting a blog post on this very issue mentioning many of the points above, so it's probably time to finish it.</span></div><div class="ms__id2414 ms__id4265" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, Sans-Serif; font-size: 14px; font-style: normal; background-color:
transparent;"><span><br></span></div><div class="ms__id2414 ms__id4265" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, Sans-Serif; font-size: 14px; font-style: normal; background-color: transparent;"><span>Cheers,</span></div><div class="ms__id2414 ms__id4265" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, Sans-Serif; font-size: 14px; font-style: normal; background-color: transparent;"><span><br></span></div><div class="ms__id2414 ms__id4265" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, Sans-Serif; font-size: 14px; font-style: normal; background-color: transparent;"><span>Jerry</span></div><div><div class="link-enhancr-attachment link-enhancr-element" id="enhancrCard_1" style='width: 450px; font-family: "Georgia", "Times", "Times New Roman", "serif"; margin-top: 5px;
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229);"> </div></td></tr></tbody></table></div><div></div><div> </div> <div class="qtdSeparateBR"><br><br></div><div class="yahoo_quoted" style="display: block;"> <div style="font-family: HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, Sans-Serif; font-size: 14px;"> <div style="font-family: HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, Sans-Serif; font-size: 16px;"> <div dir="ltr"> <font face="Arial" size="2"> On Tuesday, 21 October 2014, 12:22, Martin Koppenhoefer <dieterdreist@gmail.com> wrote:<br> </font> </div> <br><br> <div class="y_msg_container"><div id="yiv4921271691"><div><div dir="ltr">To me analyzing the given examples it seems as if a mall was necessarily a closed place while a shopping center would/could have outdoor connectivity. They appear to be similar as they both have several independent shops and collective facilities like toilets and parking. Maybe a mall has to have restaurants and
other eating facilities, while a shopping center doesn't have to (but could have). I think small sets of shops with collective parking won't qualify as "mall" but they might constitute a shopping center.<div class="yiv4921271691yqt3882798473" id="yiv4921271691yqtfd44796"><br clear="none"></div></div></div></div><br><div class="yqt3882798473" id="yqtfd04629">_______________________________________________<br clear="none">Tagging mailing list<br clear="none"><a href="mailto:Tagging@openstreetmap.org" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:Tagging@openstreetmap.org">Tagging@openstreetmap.org</a><br clear="none"><a href="https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging" target="_blank" shape="rect">https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging</a><br clear="none"></div><br><br></div> </div> </div> </div> </div></body></html>