<div dir="ltr">In exchange for a positive vote I am more than happy to share the links :-)<br><ul><li><a href="http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features/power_supply%3Dintermittent" style="font-size:13.1999998092651px">http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features/power_supply%3Dintermittent</a><br></li><li><a href="http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features/parking%3Dcar_storage">http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features/parking%3Dcar_storage</a><br></li><li><a href="http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features/camp_site%3D*">http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features/camp_site%3D*</a><br></li></ul><div>Regards,</div><div><br></div><div>Jan</div><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Wed, Mar 4, 2015 at 12:49 AM David Bannon <<a href="mailto:dbannon@internode.on.net">dbannon@internode.on.net</a>> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">On Tue, 2015-03-03 at 13:35 +0000, Jan van Bekkum wrote:<br>
<br>
Jan, for a non English speaker, you put it very well !<br>
<br>
I agree with what you have said except, perhaps dropping the voting<br>
altogether. Voting does focus the group and as it has a formal finish<br>
date, might (just might) encourage closure.<br>
<br>
But overall, well said !<br>
<br>
Incidentally, worth providing a link to proposals when you mention them.<br>
I find it quite hard to find existing proposals, perhaps because there<br>
are so many abandoned ones.<br>
<br>
David<br>
<br>
> At this moment I have three proposals the comment stage (campsite<br>
> classification, vehicle storage, camping electricity supply) with a<br>
> very simple purpose: to fill holes in the mapping possibilities for<br>
> overlanders (people travelling for a long time with their own<br>
> transport often through developing countries).<br>
><br>
><br>
> Because I was new to the voting process I haven't sent any voting<br>
> invitation yet. I first wanted to see how the process works.<br>
><br>
><br>
> As stated earlier in this trail the discussion prior to the voting is<br>
> more important than the voting itself. In my case the initial<br>
> discussion was generally very good. Some outcomes: (1) tags become<br>
> useful for a much wider audience by a slightly different definition,<br>
> (2) tags need to be adapted to avoid confusion with an already<br>
> existing tag with a different meaning, (3) English may be improved<br>
> (important for me as a not native speaker), (4) a proposed new subtag<br>
> is not needed because a tag covering the issue already exists. However<br>
> the discussion also developed into questioning tagging decisions taken<br>
> long ago that go far beyond the scope of my proposal (for example shop<br>
> vs. amenity) and may result in people rejecting a targeted proposal<br>
> because they want to make a very general point.<br>
><br>
><br>
> It was also interesting to see that the number of people participating<br>
> in the discussion is very small compared to the number of<br>
> people mapping. Apparently tag definition isn't considered important<br>
> by many.<br>
><br>
><br>
> To be honest in the case of the proposal for the reception_desk I got<br>
> the impression that one voter had collected a lobby of people not<br>
> necessarily interested in the topic: copy/paste of comments, no prior<br>
> participation in the discussion. This behaviour wouldn't help the<br>
> voting process.<br>
><br>
><br>
> At the current level of maturity of OSM new tags often start within a<br>
> special interest group that may have its own data extraction or<br>
> rendering tools using tags that interest them independent of their<br>
> status. Later on the tags may be used by more people and show up in<br>
> general rendering tools<br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
> I don't think it is good to leave tags in a "floating state" for a<br>
> long time as it will prevent people from starting to use them. It<br>
> isn't good either to start using a tag as a kind of prototype and<br>
> offer it for voting later on. One wants to have as much clarity as<br>
> possible before using a tag.<br>
><br>
> I would strongly prefer to have a clear definition under what<br>
> condition a proposal passes. For example what are significant negative<br>
> comments?<br>
><br>
><br>
> In summary I doubt if the proposed changes will bring an improvement,<br>
> but I wonder if we need voting at all, or only the preceding<br>
> discussion.<br>
><br>
><br>
> Regards,<br>
><br>
><br>
> Jan van Bekkum<br>
><br>
> On Tue, Mar 3, 2015 at 7:47 AM Bryce Nesbitt <<a href="mailto:bryce2@obviously.com" target="_blank">bryce2@obviously.com</a>><br>
> wrote:<br>
> On Mon, Mar 2, 2015 at 10:24 PM, Marc Gemis<br>
> <<a href="mailto:marc.gemis@gmail.com" target="_blank">marc.gemis@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br>
><br>
> For me this shows that the current process for tag<br>
> definition might miss a few important steps.<br>
><br>
><br>
> +1<br>
> The process works well then the proposal itself is refined and<br>
> improved through the process. The vote then becomes almost<br>
> irrelevant.<br>
> In general the main weakness I see is lack of real use. Until<br>
> real mappers start mapping real things, the true tagging does<br>
> not emerge.<br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
> Perhaps we could:<br>
> Make "trial tagging" for a time, then discuss, then retag<br>
> everything to the final scheme.<br>
> ______________________________<u></u>_________________<br>
> Tagging mailing list<br>
> <a href="mailto:Tagging@openstreetmap.org" target="_blank">Tagging@openstreetmap.org</a><br>
> <a href="https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging" target="_blank">https://lists.openstreetmap.<u></u>org/listinfo/tagging</a><br>
> ______________________________<u></u>_________________<br>
> Tagging mailing list<br>
> <a href="mailto:Tagging@openstreetmap.org" target="_blank">Tagging@openstreetmap.org</a><br>
> <a href="https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging" target="_blank">https://lists.openstreetmap.<u></u>org/listinfo/tagging</a><br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
______________________________<u></u>_________________<br>
Tagging mailing list<br>
<a href="mailto:Tagging@openstreetmap.org" target="_blank">Tagging@openstreetmap.org</a><br>
<a href="https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging" target="_blank">https://lists.openstreetmap.<u></u>org/listinfo/tagging</a><br>
</blockquote></div></div>