<div dir="ltr">@warin wrote,<div><br></div><div>>NO. The formal process is" </div><div>...</div><div>...</div><div><br></div><div><span style="font-size:16px">><b>OR</b></span><br style="font-size:16px"><span style="font-size:16px">>You can simply use the tag. There are some 235 uses from taginfo now, so it has been used. </span><br style="font-size:16px"><span style="font-size:16px">>As there are few of these tags around then it should be documented - create a new wiki page. </span><br style="font-size:16px"><span style="font-size:16px">>235 is not large but it does establish a use.</span><br></div><div><span style="font-size:16px"><br></span></div><div><span style="font-size:16px">That's almost exactly what I said. Anyone who wants to can use the tag, REGARDLESS of whether it is "approved" by the members of this or any other list. Hence my conclusion that the result of the voting is non-binding. The voting process might be used to improve the tag or, in cases where it's obviously wrong, discarded but our approval is not, strictly speaking, essential.</span></div><div><span style="font-size:16px"><br></span></div><div><span style="font-size:16px">We always strive for consensus but it cannot always be had. So... </span></div></div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Thu, Sep 21, 2017 at 1:01 PM, José G Moya Y. <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:josemoya@gmail.com" target="_blank">josemoya@gmail.com</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir="auto">Hi<div dir="auto">I agree with the permit system as it is discused here. I found it useful for National Parks, specially for World Heritage Biosphere Reservations, where a small amount of people has to book in advance.<div dir="auto">If it keeps getting a strong opposition, you could consider mapping as access=fee and adding a "book" tag somewhere in the fee system, such as fee=book, to make users know the access needs booking in advance.</div><div dir="auto">But I prefer access=permit.</div></div></div><div class="HOEnZb"><div class="h5"><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">El 21/9/2017 4:48, "Warin" <<a href="mailto:61sundowner@gmail.com" target="_blank">61sundowner@gmail.com</a>> escribió:<br type="attribution"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div text="#000000" bgcolor="#FFFFFF">
<div class="m_8242471240133606940m_-1930067318839872669moz-cite-prefix">On 21-Sep-17 11:24 AM, Dave Swarthout
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div dir="ltr">I am in total agreement with the proposal as it's
been developed in this thread.
<div><br>
</div>
<div>I too am unfamiliar with structuring the voting process but
it may be enough to simply add a new section "Voting" at the
end of the page, copying some boiler-plate from some other
proposal, and advertising on this list. The voting, just like
any discussion we engage in on these mailing lists, is open to
debate and the result is AFAIK non-binding. People can do as
they wish afterward.</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
NO. The formal process is to;<br>
1) create a proposal page - <br>
2) then call for comments as a new subject here on this list. <br>
3) After at least 2 weeks consider any comments made, modify the
proposal and if that looks good<br>
4) then call for votes as a new subject here on this list.<br>
5) after another 2 weeks and some number of votes consider if it
passes<br>
<br>
OR<br>
You can simply use the tag. There are some 235 uses from taginfo
now, so it has been used. <br>
As there are few of these tags around then it should be documented
- create a new wiki page. <br>
235 is not large but it does establish a use.<br>
<br>
Taginfo also has use of 'permit' .. no explanation of what these are
for and the numbers are small. <br>
<br>
Comment - there are a few that use it for car parks in the US. But
no information on where to obtain a permit. <br>
I do think that the permit contact details need to be available, and
this should be suggested a a 'recommendation'? on the wiki page. <br>
<br>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div dir="ltr">
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Many thanks to Kevin for the work you've done on this tag.</div>
</div>
<div class="gmail_extra"><br>
<div class="gmail_quote">On Thu, Sep 21, 2017 at 5:39 AM, Warin
<span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:61sundowner@gmail.com" target="_blank">61sundowner@gmail.com</a>></span>
wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><span>On 21-Sep-17 06:01 AM, marc marc wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
Le 20. 09. 17 à 20:39, Kevin Kenny a écrit :<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
Is this a minimal proposal that we can all tolerate?<br>
</blockquote>
I do not see any difference between access=permit and
(not tag for)<br>
access to a sports club : you can go there if you meet
certain<br>
conditions and generally any sports club allows you to
"buy a permit<br>
according to their formality"<br>
I see no difference with private property either. if you
"follow"<br>
my formalities, you will have the right to come at home.<br>
I think that it would be preferable to improve
access=private<br>
by adding a tag to describe any means of "overriding"
this restriction<br>
rather than inventing a new type of access that is
between sports clubs<br>
are public for the moment), access=private and paying
infrastructure<br>
like tool roads.<br>
</blockquote>
<br>
</span>
The primary difference between access=private and
access=permit<br>
is that a formal permit system exists that anyone can easily
use.<br>
Some permits are easy and free,<br>
some you and I cannot get (unless you are the right tribe or
have strong cultural connections).<br>
<br>
Examples;<br>
The Kokoda Trail is not 'owned' by the permit authority.<br>
Here the Trail goes through many villages and is
administered by a government appointed body.<br>
The practice here is to get a permit from the authority and
not bother with the property owners.<br>
Typically normal people will use a guided 'tour' and that
organisation will be registered with the authority and get
the individual permits.<br>
<br>
The Woomera Prohibited Areas (e.g. way 436098551) again are
not 'owned' by the authority.<br>
These areas have both the rocket range and property owners.<br>
The range operators have provided the property owners with
shelters -<br>
most of the property owners use the shelters as cool places
to shelter from the heat (as well as rockets).<br>
Here I would hope that people wanting access would negotiate
with both the permit system and the private property owner.<br>
The permit system ensures that travellers are not present
when the rockets are being fired.<br>
<br>
------------------------<br>
There is enough difference that it should be tagged together
with the way that permits can be obtained.
<div class="m_8242471240133606940m_-1930067318839872669HOEnZb">
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-- <br>
<div class="m_8242471240133606940m_-1930067318839872669gmail_signature" data-smartmail="gmail_signature">
<div dir="ltr">Dave Swarthout<br>
Homer, Alaska<br>
Chiang Mai, Thailand<br>
Travel Blog at <a href="http://dswarthout.blogspot.com" target="_blank">http://dswarthout.blogspot.com</a></div>
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<br></blockquote></div><br><br clear="all"><div><br></div>-- <br><div class="gmail_signature" data-smartmail="gmail_signature"><div dir="ltr">Dave Swarthout<br>Homer, Alaska<br>Chiang Mai, Thailand<br>Travel Blog at <a href="http://dswarthout.blogspot.com" target="_blank">http://dswarthout.blogspot.com</a></div></div>
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