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W dniu 02.12.2017 o 22:05, Pierre Béland pisze:<br>
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<div>OSM-Carto is to often thought for Western Europe and only
the developpers that contribute to the github project make
decisions. I would not base the Tagging decisions on what
the various styles are rendering. </div>
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<br>
It's a systematic bias we try to get rid of. One of the main goals
of osm-carto is diversity and universality. I can talk about more
specific examples if you want, but the most important problems are
in short:<br>
<br>
1. We lack the input from people outside the "global West". We try
to ask for it in some clear cases like fonts and symbols, and this
is where cultural differences are visible the most.<br>
<br>
2. We have no tools currently to differentiate big cities rendering
from the rural areas. This is correlated with urban areas
distribution on the West and the rest of the world, so this is
especially visible there and sounds like a cultural difference, but
of course it makes it hard also in the West.<br>
<br>
But again: osm-carto rendering is not a base to change tags, but
rather visual indicator of some other problems, including tagging.
The issue we're talking in this thread is not 1. nor 2. for example
and we render them already, but these tags usage and meaning are
questionable.<br>
<br>
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<div>And again, let's not think the Tag schema to reflect
mainly the Western Europe reality without any knowledge of
the reality of the rest of the world.</div>
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That's why I'm happy that I passed the message and people knowing
the African or Asian reality let me know about how they use some
tags. I'd like to have more input like that.<br>
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<div>While activating for the major OSM Responses since 2012,
we often had discussions on the leisure=common tag. As said
before, this is common to have such place in the middle of
villages in Africa. African contributors and humanitarians
deployed for humanitarian assistance have always aggreed to
use this tag. How important this is in the context of any
humanitarian response? This is a place where people gather,
where you can mount tents if necessary and deliver services.<br>
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Please note that these are separate things - that such places exist
and how are they tagged. <br>
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I prefer them to be tagged clearly and not introduce confusion
elsewhere. Rural/outdoor and urban environments are very different
and it's best when the tag allows to see the differences when they
are present. For me "leisure=common" does not look like a proper
name when I read the discussion.<br>
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<div>new about deaths, injured people with no assistance. We
then agree to spot some common leisure space in the
villages + add a specific humanitarian event tag
highligting this place could possibly be a helicopter
landing place.</div>
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<br>
We agree that such places should be tagged, but the current scheme
is just poor. The problems I see (not counting misuse in the urban
environment for the moment):<br>
<br>
1. It's a multifunctional place, thus not belonging to a "leisure"
space - marketplace is about retail and a helicopter landing is
about transport and emergency probably<br>
2. Both leisure=common and landuse=village_green could be used
probably, so something is wrong with these schemes, because the
choice sounds to be arbitrary. Both have clear deficiencies in this
context: leisure is not the whole truth and this can be not a green
area.<br>
<br>
We want to express that it's:<br>
- usually center of the village (which is just a geometrical
property, so no additional tag is needed)<br>
- marketplace area (amenity=marketplace is now even visible on
osm-carto)<br>
- common recreation area (we already have
landuse/leisure=recreation_ground on osm-carto)<br>
- it's a helicopter landing site (thus aeroway=helipad probably)<br>
- emergency meeting point (we have emergency=assembly_point and is
quite popular already!)<br>
<br>
So maybe it'd be better to use already existing, but precise tags -
or at least create better general tag (like "place=village_common"
or "landuse=common_ground" for example)? Trying to stretch already
existing, but not clear and troublesome local tags, is a bad thing.<br>
<br>
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<div>Please stop joking and try to think OSM as a Global
Map. Do not extrapolate from only your country mapping
experience.<br>
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This is not a joke - everybody do it, since nobody knows the whole
world.<br>
<br>
The poor tag that can be good enough for a rural place (historical
in Europe or current in Africa) can lead to bigger problems in the
urban space and this is exactly the case. Let's work on making them
clear and well defined to avoid the confusion!<br>
<br>
<pre class="moz-signature" cols="72">--
"My method is uncertain/ It's a mess but it's working" [F. Apple]</pre>
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