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<div class="moz-cite-prefix">A remote mapper cannot determine if
something will have water in it if the imagery shows no water. <br>
Nor could they determine if a water way (that has water in it in
the imagery) is seasonal or intermittent. <br>
<br>
If a mapper cannot see it or has no knowledge of it .. don't map
it! <br>
<br>
I have seen remote mappers tag things as vehicle highways ... when
they are foot paths and have never seen a vehicle. <br>
Don't map what you cannot see or don't know. <br>
<br>
On 20/05/18 12:07, Vao Matua wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:CABvwQaxDj=O52YLFkwURMZQawagGwmLE+tjF+oEa5Ciu6Vs0wg@mail.gmail.com">
<div dir="ltr">For remote mappers seasonal can be ambiguous, the
only thing that is known is that a channel or lake didn't have
water when the image was taken.
<div>In the tropics the notion of summer doesn't make sense,
it's a foreign concept. </div>
<div>intermittent=yes is a fine tag</div>
</div>
<div class="gmail_extra"><br>
<div class="gmail_quote">On Sat, May 19, 2018 at 3:29 PM, Warin
<span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:61sundowner@gmail.com"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">61sundowner@gmail.com</a>></span>
wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0
.8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">On
19/05/18 13:25, Tod Fitch wrote:<br>
<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0
.8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0
.8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
On May 18, 2018, at 7:33 PM, Warin <<a
href="mailto:61sundowner@gmail.com" target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">61sundowner@gmail.com</a>>
wrote:<br>
<br>
Hi,<br>
<br>
I seek comments and thoughts on<br>
<br>
-------------<br>
<br>
Seasonal:<br>
<br>
The seasonal tag in well established. I don't think
there is much confusion with it.<br>
<br>
<br>
---------------<br>
<br>
Intermittent:<br>
<br>
The intermittent tag continues to be confused with
seasonal.<br>
<br>
Possibly this is because some want to use it to indicate
that a follow is both seasonal and intermittent?<br>
<br>
<br>
-------------<br>
<br>
Ephemeral:<br>
<br>
There is also ephemeral being used with
stream=ephemeral. This cannot be used with other water
features e.g. lakes.<br>
<br>
I think the tag ephemeral=yes could be used, other ideas
for tagging are flow=ephemeral, water=ephemeral ...<br>
<br>
<br>
-------------------<br>
<br>
Combinations with seasonal?<br>
<br>
Think I have raised this before but not come to any firm
conclusion myself.<br>
<br>
I think that tagging<br>
<br>
seasonal=summer<br>
<br>
intermittent= yes<br>
<br>
<br>
leads to confusion. Is the summer flow intermittent? Or
is ther regular summer flow with intermittent flow at
other times of year?<br>
<br>
It may be better to tag<br>
<br>
seasonal:intermittent=summer<br>
<br>
<br>
or<br>
<br>
seasonal=summer<br>
<br>
seasonal:intermittent=winter;a<wbr>utumn;spring<br>
<br>
</blockquote>
In the semi-arid areas I’ve lived in there are “waterways”
that, if they carry water, only have water in them during
the rainy season. But, they may not carry water throughout
the rainy season. Or even carry water at all every rainy
season. So I can see some merit to indicating the
seasonality of intermittent water flow.<br>
<br>
If I recall correctly, there was some discussion a while
back about using ephemeral as either a key or as a value
to the intermittent key to cover the case where even
during a rainy season it would be rare to encounter water
and if you did the water was likely to be present for only
a few hours. But looking at the wiki and taginfo I don’t
see it being used as a value for intermittent. There are
only 82 instances of it being used as a key all with the
value “yes". And I don’t recall the final “bike shedded”
result of the mail list discussion. Apparently it did not
take hold. I personally thing “ephemeral” should be a
accepted value for the intermittent tag but apparently I
am alone in that opinion.<br>
<br>
In any case, your “seasonal:intermittent=summer” tag could
also be confusing. Does that mean that the only time you
are likely to encounter water is in summer but it is only
intermittent then? Or does it mean that there is likely to
be water in it during fall, winter and spring but it
becomes intermittent in summer? Basically has the same
issue as the current tagging you are noting as being
confusing.<br>
<br>
In reading the current wiki, I think the tagging should be
a logical and operation. If there is a seasonal tag, it
indicates the season water may be present. Then if there
is a intermittent tag it indicates that even during the
season water is present it is intermittent.<br>
<br>
</blockquote>
Ok.<br>
<br>
I think I have some 3 reasonable things to move forward
with.<br>
<br>
Intermittent clarification:<br>
<br>
Clarify the meaning of intermittent on the OSM wiki! At the
moment it says "used to indicate that a body of water does
not permanently contain water."<br>
That is too easily confused with seasonal! I think it should
say "used to indicate that a body of water only has water
irregularly." Where should this be 'discussed'?<br>
<br>
Intermittent - add values:<br>
Add seasonal values to intermittent e.g. intermittent=summer
to indicate that water might be present irregularly, but
only during summer. RFC etc?<br>
<br>
Add ephemeral:<br>
Add the ephemeral tag with the same extended values as
intermittent above. RFC etc ?<br>
<br>
<br>
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</blockquote>
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