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<p><font face="Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif">Yes, it is silly and
oxymoronic, but so are "non-papers" (a paper that is not a
paper), something we diplomats use pretty often. <br>
</font></p>
<p><font face="Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif">The problem with
calling AIT and TECRO embassies has naught to do with my status
as a U.S. diplomat. It is that they are not embassies in terms
of the Vienna Convention on Diplomatic Relations, and that's the
ultimate authority. I raised this whole issue because a
consulate is not an embassy; having opened that can of worms it
is illogical to correct that error only to insert another. If
you prefer "other" to Wikipedia's "non-diplomatic" I can
probably live with that. I cannot, however, agree with calling
AIT, TECRO, the Taliban office in Doha, or for that matter the
State of Virginia office in New Delhi "embassies". They would
be "other" and not "embassy" simply because they are not
embassies. They do not enjoy diplomatic immunities or diplomatic
status under the VCDR, any more than consulates do. Now excuse
me for a few minutes, please, as I have a non-paper to read.</font></p>
<p><font face="Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif">BTW even though the
United States does not recognize Palestine, I mapped the
Palestinian Embassy in Ashgabat as soon as it opened because </font><font
face="Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif"><font face="Helvetica,
Arial, sans-serif">in the OSM domain </font>calling it an
embassy falls under OSM rules, not U.S. government rules.
Turkmenistan recognizes Palestine and grants its "embassy" that
status under the VCDR. I mapped it as a private citizen, not as
an officer of the United States, and my mapping does not reflect
U.S. government policy in any way, shape, or form. <br>
</font></p>
On 10/27/2018 2:57 PM, Eugene Alvin Villar wrote:<br>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:CAPhqi6LHmpx3WzRGi3njmdWkseu0LsJCh8pcHX3c8eMXWckHOg@mail.gmail.com">
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<div dir="ltr">On Sat, Oct 27, 2018 at 12:52 PM
Allan Mustard <<a
href="mailto:allan@mustard.net"
moz-do-not-send="true">allan@mustard.net</a>>
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px
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<div bgcolor="#FFFFFF"> <font face="Helvetica,
Arial, sans-serif">If my sense of growing
consensus is correct, I suggest that
diplomatic=* would include only [embassy,
consulate, non-diplomatic].</font></div>
</blockquote>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Tagging something as office=diplomatic then
diplomatic=non-diplomatic sounds silly and
oxymoronic. Why not simply diplomatic=other?
Also we should allow diplomatic=yes if the
mapper doesn't know the exact type. Therefore
diplomatic=[embassy, consulate, other, yes]. (So
diplomatic=embassy applies to regular embassies,
Commonwealth of Nations' high commissions,
Vatican apostolic nunciatures, etc.)<br>
</div>
<div> </div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px
0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid
rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<div bgcolor="#FFFFFF"><font face="Helvetica,
Arial, sans-serif">It also offers a
potentially neat solution for dealing with
the non-diplomatic representations of Taiwan
and the United States in each others'
countries<br>
</font></div>
</blockquote>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>I think we should call a spade a spade. While
the Taipei Economic and Cultural Representative
Office (TECRO) in the U.S. and the American
Institute in Taiwan (AIT) are not de jure
embassies in order to adhere to the so-called
"One China" policy, these offices are de facto
embassies with their head officers having (I
think) ambassadorial rank with largely the same
rights and privileges. Since OSM mapping the
mainland Chinese territory is already an illegal
activity w.r.t. the PRC's laws, I don't think
assigning the diplomatic=embassy tag to the
ROC-related diplomatic representative offices
would make things worse and would cause a
diplomatic incident. (Well, you as a diplomat,
probably cannot say so because you are bound by
your Department of State's adherence to the One
China policy, but almost every other mapper
isn't a diplomat so we are free to map however
we want. [I can already see the BuzzFeed
headline: "U.S. envoy to Turkmenistan admits
Americans have diplomatic relations with
Taiwan".])<br>
</div>
<div> </div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px
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rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<div bgcolor="#FFFFFF"><font face="Helvetica,
Arial, sans-serif">and other non-diplomatic
representations, such as the Taliban office
in Doha.</font></div>
</blockquote>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>(This sounds interesting! <i>[Goes and
browses the "Taliban in Qatar" Wikipedia
article]</i>)<br>
</div>
<div> </div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px
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<div bgcolor="#FFFFFF"><font face="Helvetica,
Arial, sans-serif">I think limiting the
number of options for diplomatic=* to three
would simplify mapping (and avoid confusing
mappers not steeped in the lore of
diplomacy); the particular type of
diplomatic mission is in any case reflected
in the name=* tag and needs not be
duplicated in the diplomatic=* tag (e.g.,
"High Commission of Malaysia", "Embassy of
Poland", "U.S. Interests Section",
"Consulate General of Japan"). If the
status of a mission changes (e.g., the
upgrade of the U.S. Interests Section in
Havana to an embassy), changing the name
would suffice; no re-tagging would be
necessary.<br>
</font></div>
</blockquote>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>I generally agree with this idea, but with
the Taiwanese caveat I mentioned above.<br>
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<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px
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<div bgcolor="#FFFFFF"><font face="Helvetica,
Arial, sans-serif"> </font><font
face="Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif">P.S.
Regarding the question posed overnight as to
whether one may simply drop in on an
ambassador's residence, any of you who are
contributing substantively to this
discussion are welcome to drop by my
residence in Ashgabat any time you are in
town :-) Just please call ahead to make
sure I'll be home.</font><br>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>That's a great offer! Although I probably
would not be visiting Central Asia in the
foreseeable future; my passport is in the bottom
half of the Henley Passport Index so I don't
have as much opportunities to travel as citizens
in other countries. :)</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>BTW, for other people on this thread who are
not aware: yes, Allan, the U.S. ambassador to
Turkmenistan, is an active OSM mapper and has
substantially contributed to mapping
Turkmenistan in OSM outside of his official
duties. <a
href="https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Turkmenistan"
moz-do-not-send="true">https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Turkmenistan</a><br>
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