<div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr">The primary concern of mine about the current definitios of drain and ditch is that some people are differentiating them by size.<br>Since there is no consent on "drain" tag deprecation, I suggest to at least correct the current definitions to prevent the misuse. <br><br>We can either make a clear distinction between the two as suggested in Varian #1 in<br><a href="https://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/tagging/2019-February/042762.html">https://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/tagging/2019-February/042762.html</a><br><br>or stay close to dictionary definitions which assumes some overlapping between the meanings. Here is an example:<br>drain - a narrow artificial open-air channel that takes away waste liquids or rainwater<br>ditch - a narrow channel dug at the side of a road or field to hold, bring or carry away water<br><br>Cheers,</div><div>Eugene</div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">ср, 20 февр. 2019 г. в 12:50, Eugene Podshivalov <<a href="mailto:yaugenka@gmail.com">yaugenka@gmail.com</a>>:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">ср, 20 февр. 2019 г. в 02:30, Warin <<a href="mailto:61sundowner@gmail.com" target="_blank">61sundowner@gmail.com</a>>:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div bgcolor="#FFFFFF"><div class="gmail-m_-2077332703710073816gmail-m_1181316888928381883gmail-m_-2855494275657289692moz-cite-prefix">On 19/02/19 20:40, Eugene Podshivalov wrote:<br></div><blockquote type="cite"><div dir="ltr">Canals and ditches are artificial channels carrying naturual water</div></blockquote>this suggests there is 'unnatural' water... </div></blockquote><div>What does "unnatural" water mean to you? To me, "natural" means emerging from springs and flowing by it's own along an open-air channel. Examples of "unnatural" is a swimming pool which you fill in with a hose or stome water drainage channels or when water is served by a pumping station.<br>Both navigable canal and a canal of a straightened river carry water through an aritificial (digged out) channel.</div><div><br></div><div>Here is an example of such river.</div><div><a href="http://www.picshare.ru/view/9902044/" target="_blank">http://www.picshare.ru/view/9902044/</a><br></div><div>On the left is the natural waterway of a river in the year of 1937. On the right is the same river nowadays. Note that the current geometry is drawn detailed enough, it is the waterway itself which is very straght now.</div><div><br></div><div>Cheers,</div><div>Eugene</div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">ср, 20 февр. 2019 г. в 02:41, Warin <<a href="mailto:61sundowner@gmail.com" target="_blank">61sundowner@gmail.com</a>>:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<div bgcolor="#FFFFFF">
<div class="gmail-m_-2077332703710073816gmail-m_1181316888928381883gmail-m_7318643402866733412moz-cite-prefix">On 19/02/19 21:21, Tony Shield wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<p>I'm not in favour of combining ditch and drain. My mind sees a
ditch as a dug-out stream which may flow into a stream or flow
into a drain, the drain being a much larger flow. I see drains
as having water flow several metres wide but a ditch as less
than a metre of surface flow.</p>
</blockquote>
<br>
Those differences can be mapped using the key width. <br>
<br>
Other than the width .. what other differences do you see? <br>
<br>
To me; <br>
<br>
a drain is a ditch that only provides for water removal. Some of
these are small - less that 1 meter wide. The direction of water
flow will tell you if it is a supply or a removal (drain) system. <br>
<br>
a ditch could provide water supply or removal and possibly in some
cases either depending on water levels? <br>
<br>
<blockquote type="cite">
<p>TonyS<br>
</p>
<div class="gmail-m_-2077332703710073816gmail-m_1181316888928381883gmail-m_7318643402866733412moz-cite-prefix">On 11/02/2019 16:18, Hufkratzer
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div class="gmail-m_-2077332703710073816gmail-m_1181316888928381883gmail-m_7318643402866733412moz-cite-prefix">On 10.02.2019 14:57, Eugene
Podshivalov wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div dir="ltr">
<div dir="ltr">
<div dir="ltr">
<div dir="ltr">
<div dir="ltr">
<div dir="ltr">
<div dir="ltr">[...}
<div><b>Variant #2</b></div>
<div>Combine "ditch" and "drain" tags into one.</div>
<div>[...}</div>
Personally I lean toward variant 2 [...}</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
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<br>
This would require to deprecate "drain" and remove it from the
presets, otherwise we will continue to have 2 tags in the long
run. As far as I know deprecating a tag is only possible if
it's usage declines. Currently its usage increases steadily. How
do you intend to change that? What is the incentive for the
mapper to use "ditch" instead of "drain" from now on? <span style="color:rgb(33,33,33);font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:16px;font-style:normal;font-variant-ligatures:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:400;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:left;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:pre-wrap;word-spacing:0px;background-color:rgb(255,255,255);text-decoration-style:initial;text-decoration-color:initial;float:none;display:inline">I am not even sure that most mappers
will notice the change on the wiki pages.</span><br>
<br>
<br>
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