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<p>Hi,<br>
</p>
<p>from what I understood, "access aisle" is an official term only
in the US, as described in the ADA standards
(<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://www.access-board.gov/guidelines-and-standards/buildings-and-sites/about-the-ada-standards/guide-to-the-ada-standards/chapter-5-parking">https://www.access-board.gov/guidelines-and-standards/buildings-and-sites/about-the-ada-standards/guide-to-the-ada-standards/chapter-5-parking</a>),
but it describes clearly (as least for a non native English
speaker like me) what is it.</p>
<p>For mapping accessibility paths for disabled persons, I think it
is quite important to have this information, so that its presence
and accessibility from e.g. the sidewalk, is well represented
(with e.g. tags describing kerbs). This picture [0] to me
describes well the reason this can be really useful.</p>
<p>To only have amenity=parking_space mapped wouldn't help in
describing and understanding the accessibility of the parking
place from the footpaths/sidewalks. <br>
</p>
<p>I'm not sure about the use of the egress areas, that seem to be
less related to access paths for disabled persons, and more
related to areas not usable by other cars...</p>
<p>Ale<br>
</p>
<p>[0]
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://www.access-board.gov/images/guidelines_standards/Buildings_Sites/guides/chapter5/5p15a.JPG">https://www.access-board.gov/images/guidelines_standards/Buildings_Sites/guides/chapter5/5p15a.JPG</a><br>
</p>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 02/05/19 12:36, Tony Shield wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:5ecf8fae-c11d-03d7-2b8b-c19c88a0d898@gmail.com">
<meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=UTF-8">
<p>Hi</p>
<p>[AA] is a Mapillary picture of a typical UK disabled parking
bay, the hatched area is a what I think you are calling an
'access aisle'. Those particular disabled parking bays are
legally designated and enforced.</p>
<p>I see that tags <tt dir="ltr" class="mw-content-ltr"
style="background:#EEF;font-size:1em;line-height:1.6"><bdi
style="white-space:nowrap"><a
href="https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:amenity"
title="Key:amenity" moz-do-not-send="true">amenity</a></bdi>=<a
class="mw-selflink selflink" moz-do-not-send="true"><bdi>parking_space</bdi></a></tt>
and <tt dir="ltr" class="mw-content-ltr"
style="background:#EEF;font-size:1em;line-height:1.6"><bdi
style="white-space:nowrap"><a
href="https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Key:parking_space&action=edit&redlink=1"
class="new" title="Key:parking space (page does not
exist)" moz-do-not-send="true">parking_space</a></bdi>=<a
href="https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Tag:parking_space%3Ddisabled&action=edit&redlink=1"
class="new" title="Tag:parking space=disabled (page does not
exist)" moz-do-not-send="true"><bdi>disabled</bdi></a></tt>
</p>
<p>are not described in the wiki but to my mind an entry for
parking_space = disabled should meet the local space and marking
scheme so in the UK a parking_space=disabled would without
further definition include an egress space. If there is a wish
to specifically mark those hatched areas then I suggest the use
of the word 'egress' .<br>
</p>
<p>[AA] <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext"
href="https://www.mapillary.com/map/im/5PAU747rlUdNrCaDtUNDuA"
moz-do-not-send="true">https://www.mapillary.com/map/im/5PAU747rlUdNrCaDtUNDuA</a></p>
<p>Regards <br>
</p>
<p>TonyS999<br>
</p>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 02/05/2019 10:54, Volker Schmidt
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:CALQ-OR7Jv2gnah8uS4M1rjDb-eyyJXZARuPS8PfAj4LB_B+oWQ@mail.gmail.com">
<meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html;
charset=UTF-8">
<div dir="ltr">
<div>I would consider what is here described as access aisle
(according to the photo [1]) part of the parking space. Here
in Italy any parking space for the disabled has a dedicated
"access aisle" similar to the photo.<br>
</div>
<div>If you want to achieve disabled (wheelchair) routing I
would assume it to be sufficient to map the disabled parking
spaces within the car park.<br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div> [1] <a
href="https://mycloud.snowandsnow.us/index.php/s/F2mAATCQ54SzfcT"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">https://mycloud.snowandsnow.us/index.php/s/F2mAATCQ54SzfcT</a>
</div>
</div>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">
<div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Thu, 2 May 2019 at 11:31,
Tony Shield <<a href="mailto:tony.shield999@gmail.com"
moz-do-not-send="true">tony.shield999@gmail.com</a>>
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px
0.8ex;border-left:1px solid
rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<div bgcolor="#FFFFFF">
<p>Having today downloaded and read SN01360 [2] |I
disagree with the interpretation. In that document there
is only one mention of 'aisle' it being an 'access
aisle' in Section 5.4 paragraph marked Off-Street
Parking -" <span
style="font-family:FrutigerLTStd-Bold;font-size:11pt;color:rgb(0,0,0);font-style:normal;font-variant:normal"><b>Off-street
parking</b><span
style="font-family:FrutigerLTStd-Light;font-size:11pt;color:rgb(0,0,0);font-style:normal;font-variant:normal">:
bays should be a minimum of 4800 mm long<br>
<span
style="font-family:FrutigerLTStd-Light;font-size:11pt;color:rgb(0,0,0);font-style:normal;font-variant:normal">by
2400 mm wide with additional space: (1) where bays
are<br>
<span
style="font-family:FrutigerLTStd-Light;font-size:11pt;color:rgb(0,0,0);font-style:normal;font-variant:normal">parallel
to the access aisle and access is available from
the side an<br>
<span
style="font-family:FrutigerLTStd-Light;font-size:11pt;color:rgb(0,0,0);font-style:normal;font-variant:normal">extra
length of at least 180 0mm, or (2) where bays
are<br>
<span
style="font-family:FrutigerLTStd-Light;font-size:11pt;color:rgb(0,0,0);font-style:normal;font-variant:normal">perpendicular
to the access aisle, an additional width of
at least<br>
<span
style="font-family:FrutigerLTStd-Light;font-size:11pt;color:rgb(0,0,0);font-style:normal;font-variant:normal">1200
mm along each side. </span></span></span></span></span><br
style="font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;line-height:normal;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px">
</span></span></p>
<span
style="font-family:FrutigerLTStd-Bold;font-size:11pt;color:rgb(0,0,0);font-style:normal;font-variant:normal"><span
style="font-family:FrutigerLTStd-Light;font-size:11pt;color:rgb(0,0,0);font-style:normal;font-variant:normal"></span></span>
<div class="gmail-m_-6850702075196147787moz-cite-prefix">I
read that as saying the 'access aisle' is that which in
OSM is marked as 'parking _aisle', and it leads to a
parking bay designated for disabled users, the 'access
aisle' is not exclusively for the use of disabled users.
I am of the opinion that 'access' is misinterpreted to
refer only to disabled users which is a very restrictive
interpretation of the usual interpretation of access
being for anybody. I think it is something to be very
careful about.</div>
<div class="gmail-m_-6850702075196147787moz-cite-prefix">Usage
in the UK supports my interpretation - I know of many
car parks where ordinary and disabled spaces are next to
each other and accessed by a single way which has no
restrictions.<br>
</div>
<div class="gmail-m_-6850702075196147787moz-cite-prefix"><br>
</div>
<div class="gmail-m_-6850702075196147787moz-cite-prefix">For
parking bays I think that the tag:amenity=parking _space
is clear.<br>
</div>
<div class="gmail-m_-6850702075196147787moz-cite-prefix"><br>
</div>
<div class="gmail-m_-6850702075196147787moz-cite-prefix">Regards</div>
<div class="gmail-m_-6850702075196147787moz-cite-prefix">TonyS999</div>
<div class="gmail-m_-6850702075196147787moz-cite-prefix"><br>
</div>
<div class="gmail-m_-6850702075196147787moz-cite-prefix">On
02/05/2019 08:21, Alessandro Sarretta wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<p>Hi Clifford,<br>
</p>
<div class="gmail-m_-6850702075196147787moz-cite-prefix">On
02/05/19 00:13, Clifford Snow wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div dir="ltr">
<div dir="ltr">
<div dir="ltr">
<div class="gmail_quote">Since the off loading
area is called an access aisle, both in the US
and UK [2], it seem to me that it would be an
appropriate term to use. Would using
highway=footway + footway=access_aisle +
wheelchair=yes be a more acceptable tagging
scheme? My concern is that just adding
wheelchair=yes to a footway doesn't get at the
requirement for the width of the
access_aisle.
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>[1] <a
href="https://www.access-board.gov/guidelines-and-standards/buildings-and-sites/about-the-ada-standards/guide-to-the-ada-standards/chapter-5-parking"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">https://www.access-board.gov/guidelines-and-standards/buildings-and-sites/about-the-ada-standards/guide-to-the-ada-standards/chapter-5-parking</a></div>
<div>[2] <a
href="https://researchbriefings.files.parliament.uk/documents/SN01360/SN01360.pdf"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">https://researchbriefings.files.parliament.uk/documents/SN01360/SN01360.pdf</a></div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<p>I'm really supporting your proposal for a
highway=footway + footway=access_aisle.</p>
<p>I would match this with a wheelchair=designated
instead of a wheelchair=yes, as suggested by Mateusz
Konieczny.<br>
</p>
<p>Best,</p>
<p>Ale<br>
</p>
<br>
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