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<div>I’ve added a ticket to the side report:</div>
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<div>https://github.com/openstreetmap/openstreetmap-website/issues/2573 <br>
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<div>--</div>
<div>Andrew<br>
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<div id="divRplyFwdMsg" dir="ltr"><font face="Calibri, sans-serif" style="font-size:11pt" color="#000000"><b>From:</b> Andrew Hain <andrewhainosm@hotmail.co.uk><br>
<b>Sent:</b> 29 March 2020 11:19<br>
<b>To:</b> Sarah Hoffmann <lonvia@denofr.de>; Tag discussion, strategy and related tools <tagging@openstreetmap.org><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Tagging] Route names that aren’t names</font>
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<div>This tagging habit arose because the ref isn’t displayed in the side panel, only the name. Fix that and we can do a big clean-up.</div>
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<div>--</div>
<div>Andrew<br>
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<div id="x_divRplyFwdMsg" dir="ltr"><font face="Calibri, sans-serif" color="#000000" style="font-size:11pt"><b>From:</b> Sarah Hoffmann <lonvia@denofr.de><br>
<b>Sent:</b> 29 March 2020 10:41<br>
<b>To:</b> Tag discussion, strategy and related tools <tagging@openstreetmap.org><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Tagging] Route names that aren’t names</font>
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<div class="x_PlainText">Hi,<br>
<br>
On Sat, Mar 28, 2020 at 06:18:01PM +0000, Richard Fairhurst wrote:<br>
> Route relation names aren’t in a great state, are they?<br>
><br>
> The upshot: bad luck if you want to render the actual names of routes on a map. You can’t.<br>
<br>
Or want to search for them. The sad state of the name tag is the<br>
only reason why you still can't search for hiking/cycling<br>
routes on osm.org[1].<br>
<br>
[1] <a href="https://github.com/osm-search/Nominatim/issues/413">https://github.com/osm-search/Nominatim/issues/413</a><br>
<br>
> A modest proposal: let’s use the name= tag in route relations for route names. Let’s use the ref= tag for route numbers. If it doesn’t have a name, it shouldn’t have a name= tag. Same as we do everywhere else.<br>
> <br>
> If you need somewhere for a mapper-facing route description (and I can see that you need that for “part United Kingdom 5”), then I guess the obvious place to put that is the note= tag. But let’s keep it out of the name tag; and let’s have a concerted effort
to remove them from existing name tags.<br>
<br>
Problem is that a large part of routes is mistagged this way.<br>
The public transport people even officially recommend this crappy<br>
tagging for the name tag[2]. So I suspect that this particular ship<br>
has sailed a long time ago.<br>
<br>
[2] <a href="https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Proposed_features/Public_Transport&oldid=625726#Route">
https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Proposed_features/Public_Transport&oldid=625726#Route</a><br>
<br>
These days I wonder if it wouldn't be better if we introduce a tag<br>
that explicitly contains the name only. How about official_name for a,<br>
well, official name of the route and local_name for one that is used<br>
by everybody else.<br>
<br>
On top of that, it would be good to encourage more use of tags for all the<br>
other info that nowadays ends up in the name tag. Most of the are actually<br>
defined somewhere already:<br>
<br>
* ref<br>
* symbol<br>
* operator<br>
* region [3]<br>
* itinary (or, as PT people prefer: from, to, via)<br>
* section_name (section? stage? leg?)<br>
* section_ref<br>
<br>
[3] Basically the entity that 'ref'refers to. Sometimes that is a touristic<br>
area, sometimes the operator. I'd rather call it 'network' but that tag<br>
is already used for something else.<br>
<br>
If this kind of extended tagging gets widely enough used, then the<br>
name tag can just fall into oblivion.<br>
<br>
Sarah<br>
<br>
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