<div dir="ltr"><div>My thinking was more general, more along the lines of these old proposals</div><div><span style="font-weight:normal"><font size="2"><a href="https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Talk:Proposed_features/hazard">Talk:Proposed features/hazard</a><br></font></span></div><div><font size="2">i.e. a structured tagging appraoch for hazards of all types.</font></div><div><font size="2">For my taste "dooring" is one type of many that may be of interest to cyclists (incidently: the "dooring" hazard is a "cyclists-passing-close-by" hazard for motorists)</font></div><div><font size="2">I want to have easy means to find all hazards for cyclists an a given route, or also I want a router to be able to take into account the hazards when selecting a route.</font></div><div><font size="2">Maybe we should start out with a list of possible hazard types, to get a better feeling on how we should approach this.</font><br></div><div><span style="font-weight:normal"><font size="2"></font></span>
</div></div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Wed, 6 May 2020 at 13:20, <<a href="mailto:Lukas-458@web.de">Lukas-458@web.de</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div><div style="font-family:Verdana;font-size:12px"><div>"highway=path,footway,cycleway is in a doorzone
<div>bicycle:doorzone=yes (the bicycle lane of the path,footway,cycleway is in a doorzone) <a href="https://deref-web-02.de/mail/client/tX1wLGYFGQI/dereferrer/?redirectUrl=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.mapillary.com%2Fmap%2Fim%2FewtPBxYM_289cWusHEWytw" target="_blank">https://www.mapillary.com/map/im/ewtPBxYM_289cWusHEWytw</a>"</div>
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<div>I agree with that, but then note that for "justice" we would need a foot:doorzone=yes, too, because when a sidewalk is in the parking car's doorzone (I think most sidewalks next to parking:lane=parallel are), there is hazard for pedestrians, too. It might be not soo dangerus because pedestrians have much lower speed than cyclists often have, but if we want to tag that hazard I think we would have to affect both, foot and bicycle.</div>
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<div style="margin:0px 0px 10px"><b>Gesendet:</b> Dienstag, 05. Mai 2020 um 04:56 Uhr<br>
<b>Von:</b> "Andrew Harvey" <<a href="mailto:andrew.harvey4@gmail.com" target="_blank">andrew.harvey4@gmail.com</a>><br>
<b>An:</b> "Tag discussion, strategy and related tools" <<a href="mailto:tagging@openstreetmap.org" target="_blank">tagging@openstreetmap.org</a>><br>
<b>Betreff:</b> Re: [Tagging] Doorzone bicycle lanes</div>
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<div>On Tue, 5 May 2020 at 02:35, Jan Michel <<a href="mailto:jan@mueschelsoft.de" target="_blank">jan@mueschelsoft.de</a>> wrote:</div>
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<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">On 03.05.20 19:16, Volker Schmidt wrote:<br>
> I would advocate a more generic approach that remains open to other<br>
> types of hazards (there are many, unfortunately).<br>
> A generic<br>
> hazard:bicycle=yes|dooring|pedestrians_on_cycleway|dangerous_exit|whatever<br>
<br>
I agree, but I would rather use<br>
cycleway:(left|right|both|):hazard<br>
'hazard:bicycle' suggests that it is an hazard to all bicycles, but it's<br>
more like an hazard that is a "feature" of the cycleway. Everybody close<br>
to the cycleway is part of the hazard (whether active or passive) but<br>
bicycles in other places of the road are not affected.</blockquote>
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<div class="gmail_attr">On Tue, 5 May 2020 at 04:33, Volker Schmidt <<a href="mailto:voschix@gmail.com" target="_blank">voschix@gmail.com</a>> wrote:</div>
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<div>You are right that in case of cycling infrastructure tagged on the road (like typically cycling lanes) we need a way to indicate to which part of the road it refers, in addition to the type of haxard.</div>
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<div>Agree with Volker here.</div>
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<div>cycleway:both:hazard becomes an issue when there are multiple hazards that apply, so "doorzone" should be part of the key not the value.</div>
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<div>I originally proposed cycleway:lane:doorzone=yes but then since seeing <a href="https://www.mapillary.com/map/im/ewtPBxYM_289cWusHEWytw" target="_blank">https://www.mapillary.com/map/im/ewtPBxYM_289cWusHEWytw</a> changed it to cycleway:doorzone=yes, but based on what Volker has said about indicating which part of the road it applies to maybe after all:</div>
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<div>cycleway:lane:doorzone=yes (both sides of the road have a doorzone cyclelane) <a href="https://www.mapillary.com/map/im/MXuDWHZY_R9UkGcOk0FZUw" target="_blank">https://www.mapillary.com/map/im/MXuDWHZY_R9UkGcOk0FZUw</a></div>
<div>cycleway:lane:left:doorzone=yes (left side of the road has a doorzone cyclelane)</div>
<div>cycleway:lane:right:doorzone=yes</div>
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<div>highway=path,footway,cycleway is in a doorzone</div>
<div>bicycle:doorzone=yes (the bicycle lane of the path,footway,cycleway is in a doorzone) <a href="https://www.mapillary.com/map/im/ewtPBxYM_289cWusHEWytw" target="_blank">https://www.mapillary.com/map/im/ewtPBxYM_289cWusHEWytw</a></div>
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<div>The third scenario for dooring is just a regular road with no bicycle infrastructure, but parked cars can still lead to dooring eg <a href="https://www.mapillary.com/map/im/6YlYnuZPdlziwUsF1m7yWA" target="_blank">https://www.mapillary.com/map/im/6YlYnuZPdlziwUsF1m7yWA</a> I guess in that case where there is no bicycle infrastructure the dooring hazard should be determined by a parking:lane:parallel=* and some kind of parking:lane buffer tag?</div>
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<div>Are there any other scenarios where dooring is a hazard?</div>
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