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I do believe that uncontrolled should be deprecated in favour of
marked, which iD already did. I also agree that marked/unmarked was
a good improved in the crossing scheme, but it should be cleared on
the wiki page, which seems to favour the uncontrolled tag.<br>
About your considerations:<br>
<br>
1 - That depends on the country. For example, in Portugal, all
crossings have right of way over vehicles. So, marking a crossing is
the same whatever the type you map (besides unmarked, of course)<br>
<br>
2 - I think there area already tags for all that. You can check them
here under "Additional tags":
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:crossing">https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:crossing</a><br>
<br>
3 - Same as previous point.<br>
<br>
4 - In the same page, under "Mode of transport"<br>
<br>
5 - There's also reference to that in the page, but I agree this is
not very clear and is scattered in several wikis, like this:
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:footway%3Dcrossing">https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:footway%3Dcrossing</a><br>
<br>
Regards,<br>
António<br>
<br>
<br>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">Às 21:40 de 16/09/2020, Taskar Center
escreveu:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:480FB805-29CE-4D76-A86F-94CD2DF17B1A@uw.edu">
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<div dir="ltr">Hi,</div>
<div dir="ltr"><br>
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<div dir="ltr">crossing has been a very poor tag because it
seems to be the kitchen sink for all the questions pertaining
to crossings...
<div>Many of the attributes that get values in "crossing" are
potentially overlapping and not mutually exclusive, causing
a lot of confusion and poorly tagged crossings.
Nevertheless, specifying crossings is very important because
it's a highly contested street region.</div>
<div><br>
<div>The crossing tag has held many values that may overlap,
and we should once and for all split out all these
different tags so we can be mapping what we mean and mean
what we map.</div>
<div>Questions we should be answering when mapping a
crossing:</div>
<div>1) How is this shared space controlled? A crossing is a
high risk environment where traversal is shared between
cars and pedestrians (they are of unequal footing). So the
type of 'control' and 'right of way' in that space is
important to specify. 'uncontrolled' is a very bad tag in
this direction because it has an actual legal,
non-intuitive meaning and many mappers mistakenly think a
crossing that has no traffic signal is uncontrolled- so
that's a really bad tag.</div>
<div>crossing_control= ?</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>2) How is the space demarcated? A crossing may be
demarcated by a number of different ground markers, it may
also be physically demarcated from other street
environments by raised footway, tactile paving or
reflectors.</div>
<div>crossing_ref=? (for visual demarcation)</div>
<div>additional tag for physical demarcation?</div>
<div>(I'm in disagreement with those saying it's superfluous
or hard to tag this way)</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>3) How can a pedestrian call up the signal and how can
they sense whose right of way is currently allowed?</div>
<div>Is there a call button? Does it chirp, speak out,
vibrate?</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>4) who is sharing the way (also a bicycle crossing,
animal crossing, etc)?</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>5) How is the space connected to the rest of the
transportation layer? to the pedestrian layer? Crossings
should really only extend from curb to curb, so that the
kerb could be properly tagged for its physical
characteristics. The habit of extending crossings all the
way into and overlapping with sidewalk spaces is a pretty
bad idea considering those are protected pedestrian spaces
and have very semantic meaning to pedestrians than the
high risk crossing environment.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>I think crossing=marked/unmarked was a really good step
in the direction of getting resolution and refinement on
at least one of these questions above. We should now move
together to refine the definitions and values for these
other questions...</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Best,</div>
</div>
<div>Anat</div>
</div>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">
<div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr"><br>
<br>
<div dir="ltr" id="AppleMailSignature">Sent from my mobile.
Please excuse brevity and typos.</div>
On Wed, Sep 16, 2020 at 4:41 PM Clifford Snow <<a
href="mailto:clifford@snowandsnow.us"
moz-do-not-send="true">clifford@snowandsnow.us</a>>
wrote:<br>
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<div class="gmail_quote">
<div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Wed, Sep 16, 2020
at 2:46 PM Graeme Fitzpatrick <<a
href="mailto:graemefitz1@gmail.com" target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">graemefitz1@gmail.com</a>>
wrote:<br>
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<div>I must admit that I only do crossings as
=traffic_signals; =marked (by itself) for
zebra crossings; & =unmarked where there
is provision to cross the road but no signage
or roadway markings on any sort.<br>
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<div>I do crossings as crossing=marked/unmarked. I
believe software should be able to identify if the
crossing has a stop sign or traffic signal. Pedestrian
walk/don't walk are low on my radar right now.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>I stopped using zebra since they seemed more
appropriate for a crossing in England than where I
live in the US. Crossing=marked/unmarked the only
thing I see where I map them. </div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>BTW - I believe in the US hitting a pedestrian in a
marked crossing is illegal most everywhere. In some
cities, drivers seem to believe they have the right of
way over pedestrians, even if they are in a marked
crossing. </div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>In another country I've spent some time in, cars
definitely have the right of way over pedestrians. </div>
</div>
-- <br>
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<div>@osm_washington<br>
</div>
<div><a href="https://www.snowandsnow.us"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">www.snowandsnow.us</a></div>
<div>OpenStreetMap: Maps with a human touch</div>
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