<div dir="ltr"><div>The ways making up a cycle route typically have names themselves, and the Route name normally is not the name of the way,</div><div>Hence in many cases this would be a mapping error, i.e. the name of the way is not correctly tagged in the database.</div><div><br></div><div>There may be exceptions to this general, abstract statement, so it would be useful if you could five pointers to specific examples.</div><div>For example it is well possible that a local administration assigns the name of the Route as name to a specific way that is part of the Route, so certainly any corrections need either local knowledge or street level photos that show name signs (e.g. Mapillary)<br></div><div><br></div><div> <br></div></div><div id="DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2"><br>
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</table><a href="#DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2" width="1" height="1"></a></div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Mon, 16 Nov 2020 at 17:22, Seth Deegan <<a href="mailto:jayandseth@gmail.com">jayandseth@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr"><p style="margin:0.5em 0px;color:rgb(32,33,34);font-family:sans-serif;font-size:14px">The <a href="https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Cycle_routes#Tagging_cycle_route_networks" target="_blank">Cycle Routes Wiki Page</a> states:</p><dl style="margin-top:0.2em;margin-bottom:0.5em;color:rgb(32,33,34);font-family:sans-serif;font-size:14px"><dd style="margin-left:1.6em;margin-bottom:0.1em;margin-right:0px">"It is preferred to tag the cycle routes using relations instead of tagging the ways."</dd></dl><p style="margin:0.5em 0px;color:rgb(32,33,34);font-family:sans-serif;font-size:14px">If I come across a route that has the Ways already tagged with the <tt dir="ltr" style="font-family:monospace,monospace;font-size:1em;direction:ltr;background:rgb(238,238,255) none repeat scroll 0% 0%;line-height:1.6"><a href="https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:name" title="Key:name" style="text-decoration-line:none;color:rgb(11,0,128);background:rgba(0,0,0,0) none repeat scroll 0% 0%" target="_blank">name</a>=*</tt> of the route, can I delete the <tt dir="ltr" style="font-family:monospace,monospace;font-size:1em;direction:ltr;background:rgb(238,238,255) none repeat scroll 0% 0%;line-height:1.6"><a href="https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:name" title="Key:name" style="text-decoration-line:none;color:rgb(11,0,128);background:rgba(0,0,0,0) none repeat scroll 0% 0%" target="_blank">name</a>=*</tt>s in the Ways and just create a Route Relation with the name?</p><p style="margin:0.5em 0px;color:rgb(32,33,34);font-family:sans-serif;font-size:14px">I assume this is not prefered because a number of applications use the names in the Ways themselves and not the Route Relation, most notably osm-carto.</p><p style="margin:0.5em 0px;color:rgb(32,33,34);font-family:sans-serif;font-size:14px">However, some benefits of doing this might be:</p><ul style="margin:0.3em 0px 0px 1.6em;padding:0px;color:rgb(32,33,34);font-family:sans-serif;font-size:14px"><li style="margin-bottom:0.1em">Takes up less space in the DB</li><li style="margin-bottom:0.1em">More tags that apply to the whole coute could be added to the Relation like <tt dir="ltr" style="font-family:monospace,monospace;font-size:1em;direction:ltr;background:rgb(238,238,255) none repeat scroll 0% 0%;line-height:1.6"><a href="https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:surface" title="Key:surface" style="text-decoration-line:none;color:rgb(11,0,128);background:rgba(0,0,0,0) none repeat scroll 0% 0%" target="_blank">surface</a>=*</tt> and <tt dir="ltr" style="font-family:monospace,monospace;font-size:1em;direction:ltr;background:rgb(238,238,255) none repeat scroll 0% 0%;line-height:1.6"><a href="https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:source" title="Key:source" style="text-decoration-line:none;color:rgb(11,0,128);background:rgba(0,0,0,0) none repeat scroll 0% 0%" target="_blank">source</a>=*</tt> (like the official map of the route).</li><li style="margin-bottom:0.1em">Ways with two or more routes wouldn't be tagged <tt dir="ltr" style="font-family:monospace,monospace;font-size:1em;direction:ltr;background:rgb(238,238,255) none repeat scroll 0% 0%;line-height:1.6"><a href="https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:name" title="Key:name" style="text-decoration-line:none;color:rgb(11,0,128);background:rgba(0,0,0,0) none repeat scroll 0% 0%" target="_blank">name</a>=<a href="https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Tag:name%3Droute_1_%26_route_2&action=edit&redlink=1" title="Tag:name=route 1 & route 2 (page does not exist)" style="text-decoration-line:none;color:rgb(165,88,88);background:rgba(0,0,0,0) none repeat scroll 0% 0%" target="_blank">route 1 & route 2</a></tt> and instead have their respective Relations. This could help with preferred routing/data usage in general.</li></ul><div><font face="sans-serif" color="#202122"><span style="font-size:14px"><br></span></font></div><p style="margin:0.5em 0px;color:rgb(32,33,34);font-family:sans-serif;font-size:14px">I would propose that <i>all</i> routes and their names should be tagged in a Relation and <i>never</i> the Ways, even if the Route Relation only has <i>one member</i>. </p><p style="margin:0.5em 0px;color:rgb(32,33,34);font-family:sans-serif;font-size:14px">This way data consumers know that all Routes are going to be relations. Also future Routes mapped that share the Way of a Route that does not have Relation, won't require the mapper to shift all of the data stored in the Way to a new Relation. </p><p style="margin:0.5em 0px;color:rgb(32,33,34);font-family:sans-serif;font-size:14px">Also, if <a href="https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features/Relation:street" title="Proposed features/Relation:street" style="text-decoration-line:none;color:rgb(11,0,128);background:rgba(0,0,0,0) none repeat scroll 0% 0%" target="_blank">Proposed features/Relation:street</a> is ever approved, this would help establish a consistent OSM-wide routing standard.</p><p style="margin:0.5em 0px;color:rgb(32,33,34);font-family:sans-serif;font-size:14px"><b><br></b></p><p style="margin:0.5em 0px;color:rgb(32,33,34);font-family:sans-serif;font-size:14px"><b>As for now</b>, I do not think that we should be deleting the <tt dir="ltr" style="font-family:monospace,monospace;font-size:1em;direction:ltr;background:rgb(238,238,255) none repeat scroll 0% 0%;line-height:1.6"><a href="https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:name" title="Key:name" style="text-decoration-line:none;color:rgb(11,0,128);background:rgba(0,0,0,0) none repeat scroll 0% 0%" target="_blank">name</a>=*</tt>s of Ways. However, I think osm-carto <i>should</i> render and <i>prefer</i> to render Relation names for Cycle routes over the names of the Ways. The Editors should also somehow influence users to map Relations for Cycle routes instead of naming them.</p><p style="margin:0.5em 0px;color:rgb(32,33,34);font-family:sans-serif;font-size:14px"><br></p><p style="margin:0.5em 0px;color:rgb(32,33,34);font-family:sans-serif;font-size:14px">Thoughts?</p><div>Seth Deegan (lectrician1)</div></div>
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