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<div style="outline: none; box-sizing: border-box; user-select: text !important; -webkit-tap-highlight-color: rgba(0, 0, 0, 0); -webkit-user-drag: none; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: -apple-system, system-ui, BlinkMacSystemFont, "Segoe UI", Roboto, "Helvetica Neue", Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif, "Apple Color Emoji", "Segoe UI Emoji", "Segoe UI Symbol"; font-size: 16px; font-style: normal; font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); text-decoration-thickness: initial; text-decoration-style: initial; text-decoration-color: initial;"><div><br></div><div>Thanks for the summary.<br></div></div><div style="outline: none; box-sizing: border-box; user-select: text !important; -webkit-tap-highlight-color: rgba(0, 0, 0, 0); -webkit-user-drag: none; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: -apple-system, system-ui, BlinkMacSystemFont, "Segoe UI", Roboto, "Helvetica Neue", Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif, "Apple Color Emoji", "Segoe UI Emoji", "Segoe UI Symbol"; font-size: 16px; font-style: normal; font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); text-decoration-thickness: initial; text-decoration-style: initial; text-decoration-color: initial;"><br></div><div style="outline: none; box-sizing: border-box; user-select: text !important; -webkit-tap-highlight-color: rgba(0, 0, 0, 0); -webkit-user-drag: none; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: -apple-system, system-ui, BlinkMacSystemFont, "Segoe UI", Roboto, "Helvetica Neue", Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif, "Apple Color Emoji", "Segoe UI Emoji", "Segoe UI Symbol"; font-size: 16px; font-style: normal; font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); text-decoration-thickness: initial; text-decoration-style: initial; text-decoration-color: initial;">If I understand you correctly, you don't want to use landuse but rather extend the use of natural=scrub? You then want to add an additional tag to natural=scrub like managed or denotation. <br></div><div style="outline: none; box-sizing: border-box; user-select: text !important; -webkit-tap-highlight-color: rgba(0, 0, 0, 0); -webkit-user-drag: none; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: -apple-system, system-ui, BlinkMacSystemFont, "Segoe UI", Roboto, "Helvetica Neue", Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif, "Apple Color Emoji", "Segoe UI Emoji", "Segoe UI Symbol"; font-size: 16px; font-style: normal; font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); text-decoration-thickness: initial; text-decoration-style: initial; text-decoration-color: initial;"><br></div><div style="outline: none; box-sizing: border-box; user-select: text !important; -webkit-tap-highlight-color: rgba(0, 0, 0, 0); -webkit-user-drag: none; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: -apple-system, system-ui, BlinkMacSystemFont, "Segoe UI", Roboto, "Helvetica Neue", Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif, "Apple Color Emoji", "Segoe UI Emoji", "Segoe UI Symbol"; font-size: 16px; font-style: normal; font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); text-decoration-thickness: initial; text-decoration-style: initial; text-decoration-color: initial;">I understand your opinion about landuse and I think I agree. The question is then, introduce a new natural value or re-built natural=scrub. One thing though, especially some native English speakers stated is that when they think of scrub, they think of the wild version and not the decorative we are talking about. With "scrubland" in the description of the wiki page, I would also think the same. I also understand though that natual=shrub would potentially conflict with natural=scrub<br></div><div style="outline: none; box-sizing: border-box; user-select: text !important; -webkit-tap-highlight-color: rgba(0, 0, 0, 0); -webkit-user-drag: none; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: -apple-system, system-ui, BlinkMacSystemFont, "Segoe UI", Roboto, "Helvetica Neue", Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif, "Apple Color Emoji", "Segoe UI Emoji", "Segoe UI Symbol"; font-size: 16px; font-style: normal; font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); text-decoration-thickness: initial; text-decoration-style: initial; text-decoration-color: initial;"><br></div><div style="outline: none; box-sizing: border-box; user-select: text !important; -webkit-tap-highlight-color: rgba(0, 0, 0, 0); -webkit-user-drag: none; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: -apple-system, system-ui, BlinkMacSystemFont, "Segoe UI", Roboto, "Helvetica Neue", Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif, "Apple Color Emoji", "Segoe UI Emoji", "Segoe UI Symbol"; font-size: 16px; font-style: normal; font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); text-decoration-thickness: initial; text-decoration-style: initial; text-decoration-color: initial;">If natural=scrub is adjusted, the wiki page of natural=scrub would then need to be adjusted to match both scrub on (un)cultivated land and decorative as illustrated in the images in my proposal. The definition then needs to be broadened to give a range of possible definitions (e.g. scrubland, scrub, for decorative purposes etc).<br></div><div style="outline: none; box-sizing: border-box; user-select: text !important; -webkit-tap-highlight-color: rgba(0, 0, 0, 0); -webkit-user-drag: none; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: -apple-system, system-ui, BlinkMacSystemFont, "Segoe UI", Roboto, "Helvetica Neue", Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif, "Apple Color Emoji", "Segoe UI Emoji", "Segoe UI Symbol"; font-size: 16px; font-style: normal; font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); text-decoration-thickness: initial; text-decoration-style: initial; text-decoration-color: initial;"><div style="outline: none; box-sizing: border-box; user-select: text !important; -webkit-tap-highlight-color: rgba(0, 0, 0, 0); -webkit-user-drag: none;"><div style="outline: none; box-sizing: border-box; user-select: text !important; -webkit-tap-highlight-color: rgba(0, 0, 0, 0); -webkit-user-drag: none;"><br></div></div><div style="outline: none; box-sizing: border-box; user-select: text !important; -webkit-tap-highlight-color: rgba(0, 0, 0, 0); -webkit-user-drag: none;">Additionally, I would personally only use denotation and not managed. Currently, you also don't add managed=yes to a natural=tree. I think that if we extend the values of denotation, it can say more about the scrub than managed=yes. Possible values: denotation=urban|wild|decoration.<br></div></div><div style="outline: none; box-sizing: border-box; user-select: text !important; -webkit-tap-highlight-color: rgba(0, 0, 0, 0); -webkit-user-drag: none; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: -apple-system, system-ui, BlinkMacSystemFont, "Segoe UI", Roboto, "Helvetica Neue", Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif, "Apple Color Emoji", "Segoe UI Emoji", "Segoe UI Symbol"; font-size: 16px; font-style: normal; font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); text-decoration-thickness: initial; text-decoration-style: initial; text-decoration-color: initial;"><br></div><div style="outline: none; box-sizing: border-box; user-select: text !important; -webkit-tap-highlight-color: rgba(0, 0, 0, 0); -webkit-user-drag: none; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: -apple-system, system-ui, BlinkMacSystemFont, "Segoe UI", Roboto, "Helvetica Neue", Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif, "Apple Color Emoji", "Segoe UI Emoji", "Segoe UI Symbol"; font-size: 16px; font-style: normal; font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); text-decoration-thickness: initial; text-decoration-style: initial; text-decoration-color: initial;">Greetings,<br></div><div style="outline: none; box-sizing: border-box; user-select: text !important; -webkit-tap-highlight-color: rgba(0, 0, 0, 0); -webkit-user-drag: none; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: -apple-system, system-ui, BlinkMacSystemFont, "Segoe UI", Roboto, "Helvetica Neue", Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif, "Apple Color Emoji", "Segoe UI Emoji", "Segoe UI Symbol"; font-size: 16px; font-style: normal; font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); text-decoration-thickness: initial; text-decoration-style: initial; text-decoration-color: initial;">Vincent<br></div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div>13 feb. 2021 23:19 van bert.araali.afritastic@gmail.com:<br></div><blockquote class="tutanota_quote" style="border-left: 1px solid #93A3B8; padding-left: 10px; margin-left: 5px;"><p>SUMMARY:<br></p><p>Question 1: consensus on no support creating another top level
key:value. landuse:shrub / landuse:bush. Landcover and landform
surely not supported.<br></p><p>Question 2: natural=scrub should be used, mapped as an area on or
within an area with a defined landuse. managed=* is optional,
denotation as with trees to further define it's significance..
Actions: extend the related wiki pages with description of what is
cultivated and uncultivated LAND and how to map and tag + what is
to be used to map and tag cultivated and/or managed VEGETATION
(regardless if it is located on cultivated or uncultivated land).<br></p><p>Question 3: barrier=hedge should not be used in these cases. It
should be used when the vegetation is predominately linear AND has
either a primary purpose or use as barrier, or boundary or border.
Hedges covers both managed / maintained as unmaintained / not
managed. ("cultivated" has never been used as a term with hedges
as far as I can recall).<br></p><p><span class=""></span><br></p><p><span class=""></span></p><div><span class="font" style="font-family:menlo,consolas,"courier new",monospace">Greetings and keep discussing !<br> Bert Araali</span></div><span class=""><span class=""><div><span class="font" style="font-family:menlo,consolas,"courier new",monospace"><bdi></bdi></span><br></div></span></span><p></p><div class="">On 13/02/2021 16:30, Volker Schmidt
wrote:<br></div><blockquote type="cite"><div dir="auto">This looks again a confusion of scrub and shrub<br></div><div><br></div><div class=""><div class="" dir="ltr">On Sat, 13 Feb 2021, 12:01
Peter Neale via Tagging, <<a href="mailto:tagging@openstreetmap.org" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">tagging@openstreetmap.org</a>>
wrote:<br></div><blockquote style="margin:0 0 0
.8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex" class=""><div><div style="font-family:times new roman,new
york,times,serif;font-size:16px"><div><div dir="ltr">IMHO Scrub that has been managed is not
scrub any more.<br></div><div dir="ltr"><br></div><div dir="ltr"><div>The Wiki says, "<br></div><span><div><span style="color: rgb(32, 33, 34);"><span class="font" style="font-family:sans-serif"><span class="size" style="font-size:14px">The
tag </span></span></span><span class="font" style="font-family:menlo,consolas,"courier new",monospace"><a target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer" style="color:rgb(6,69,173);background:none" title="Key:natural" href="https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:natural">natural</a>=scrub</span><span style="color: rgb(32, 33, 34);"><span class="font" style="font-family:sans-serif"><span class="size" style="font-size:14px"> is
used to tag areas of uncultivated land covered
with shrubs, bushes or stunted trees."</span></span></span><br></div></span></div><div dir="ltr"><span><span style="color: rgb(32, 33, 34);"><span class="font" style="font-family:sans-serif"><span class="size" style="font-size:14px"></span></span></span></span><br></div><div dir="ltr"><span><span style="color: rgb(32, 33, 34);"><span class="font" style="font-family:sans-serif"><span class="size" style="font-size:14px">..and
see also, </span></span></span></span><a target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer" href="https://www.thefreedictionary.com/scrubland">https://www.thefreedictionary.com/scrubland</a>,
which says, <br></div><div dir="ltr"><br></div><div dir="ltr"><div>" <br></div><div><h2 style="font-weight:normal;display:inline-block;margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:6px;margin-left:0px;color:rgb(64,64,64);font-family:Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif">scrub·land<br></h2><div><span style="color: rgb(64, 64, 64);"><span class="font" style="font-family:Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif"> </span></span><span style="vertical-align: text-bottom; margin: 0px 3px 2px; display: inline-block; width: 12px; color: rgb(64, 64, 64); min-height: 20px;"><span class="font" style="font-family:Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif"><span style="display: inline-block; margin: 0px; vertical-align: text-bottom; letter-spacing: -1px; color: white; width: 12px; min-height: 18px;" title=""><span class="size" style="font-size:0px"></span></span></span></span><span style="color: rgb(64, 64, 64);"><span class="font" style="font-family:Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif"> </span></span><span style="color: rgb(64, 64, 64);"><span class="font" style="font-family:Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif">(skrŭb′lănd′)</span></span> <br></div><div style="min-width:200px;color:rgb(64,64,64);font-family:Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif"><div><i>n.</i> <br></div><div style="min-width:200px;margin-left:1cm">An <span>area</span> of <span>land</span> <span>that</span> is <span>uncultivated</span> <span>and</span> <span>covered</span> <span>with</span> <span>sparse</span> <span>stunted</span> <span>vegetation."</span><br></div><div style="min-width:200px;margin-left:1cm"><span></span><br></div><div style="min-width:200px;margin-left:1cm"><span></span><br></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></blockquote></div></blockquote></blockquote><div><br></div> </body>
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