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<p><font face="Verdana">Hi Graeme,</font></p>
<p><font face="Verdana">You are confused with the purpose of the
"natural" key. "Natural" is used to tag natural features, even
grassland, rocks etc... and of course vegetation. It doesn't
matter if it has grown "naturally" or is planted by humans. <br>
</font></p>
<p><font face="Verdana">To your first example (<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/434318204">https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/434318204</a>),
natural=scrub = GOOD, leisure = nature_reserve = GOOD but is it
actually a nature_reserve ? Nature Reserves can be better mapped
as boundary = protected_area with a protection class. In this
case would much better fit the use and purpose. You can
additionally add the key "managed" (not "maintained", it is
"managed"), even define an addtional value for it to provide
more detail. PArts of it seem to have grown to become trees, if
you like to provide more detail these can be mapped as separate
areas with natural=wood.</font></p>
<p><font face="Verdana">The second example (</font><a
href="https://goo.gl/maps/hj7UpiqKWYGXamHA7">https://goo.gl/maps/hj7UpiqKWYGXamHA7</a>)
is a perfect match with an example given in the proposal (see <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/File:Example_4_landuse_bush.png">https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/File:Example_4_landuse_bush.png</a>).
True not linear features so NOT barrier=hedge.<br>
If accepted we would tag it as natural=scrub and optionally you
can add managed=yes or managed=clipped or trimmed. As still
ongoing discussion as to provide an extra denotation you could add
denotation=decorative or denotation=landscaping.</p>
<p>Greetings,</p>
<p>Bert Araali<br>
</p>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 14/02/2021 02:26, Graeme Fitzpatrick
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:CAP4zaXqmc7UCqmRb=w8rTKFAkytQswk_B0GWzU-f=Wb=yhLc_A@mail.gmail.com">
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<div dir="ltr"><br clear="all">
<br>
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<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">
<div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Sat, 13 Feb 2021 at
21:01, Peter Neale via Tagging <<a
href="mailto:tagging@openstreetmap.org"
moz-do-not-send="true">tagging@openstreetmap.org</a>>
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px
0.8ex;border-left:1px solid
rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<div>
<div style="font-family:times new roman,new
york,times,serif;font-size:16px">
<div>
<div dir="ltr">IMHO Scrub that has been managed is not
scrub any more.</div>
<div dir="ltr"><br>
</div>
<div dir="ltr">The Wiki says, "<span><span
style="color:rgb(32,33,34);font-family:sans-serif;font-size:14px">The
tag </span><tt dir="ltr"
style="font-family:monospace,monospace;font-size:1em;direction:ltr;color:rgb(32,33,34);background:rgb(238,238,255)
none repeat scroll 0% 0%;line-height:1.6"><a
href="https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:natural"
title="Key:natural"
style="color:rgb(6,69,173);background:rgba(0,0,0,0)
none repeat scroll 0% 0%" rel="nofollow"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">natural</a>=scrub</tt><span
style="color:rgb(32,33,34);font-family:sans-serif;font-size:14px"> is
used to tag areas of uncultivated land covered
with shrubs, bushes or stunted trees."</span></span></div>
<div dir="ltr"><span><span
style="color:rgb(32,33,34);font-family:sans-serif;font-size:14px"><br>
</span></span></div>
<div dir="ltr"><span><span
style="color:rgb(32,33,34);font-family:sans-serif;font-size:14px">..and
see also, </span></span><a
href="https://www.thefreedictionary.com/scrubland"
rel="nofollow" target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">https://www.thefreedictionary.com/scrubland</a>,
which says, </div>
<div dir="ltr"><br>
</div>
<div dir="ltr">"
<div>
<h2
style="font-weight:normal;display:inline-block;margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:6px;margin-left:0px;color:rgb(64,64,64);font-family:Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif">scrub·land</h2>
<span
style="color:rgb(64,64,64);font-family:Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif"> </span><span
style="vertical-align:text-bottom;margin:0px 3px
2px;display:inline-block;width:12px;color:rgb(64,64,64);font-family:Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif;min-height:20px"><span
title=""
style="display:inline-block;margin:0px;vertical-align:text-bottom;font-size:0px;letter-spacing:-1px;color:white;width:12px;min-height:18px"></span></span><span
style="color:rgb(64,64,64);font-family:Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif"> </span><span
style="color:rgb(64,64,64);font-family:Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif">(skrŭb′lănd′)</span>
<div
style="min-width:200px;color:rgb(64,64,64);font-family:Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif"><i>n.</i>
<div style="min-width:200px;margin-left:1cm">An <span>area</span> of <span>land</span> <span>that</span> is <span>uncultivated</span> <span>and</span> <span>covered</span> <span>with</span> <span>sparse</span> <span>stunted</span> <span>vegetation."</span></div>
<div style="min-width:200px;margin-left:1cm"><span><br>
</span></div>
<div style="min-width:200px;margin-left:1cm"><span><br>
</span></div>
<div style="min-width:200px;margin-left:1cm"><span><br>
</span></div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<div dir="ltr"><span><span
style="color:rgb(32,33,34);font-family:sans-serif;font-size:14px"><br>
</span></span></div>
<div dir="ltr"><span><span
style="color:rgb(32,33,34);font-family:sans-serif;font-size:14px">So
"<span><span
style="color:rgb(38,40,42);font-family:Helvetica
Neue,Helvetica,Arial,sans-serif">natural=scrub
+ managed=yes"</span></span></span></span></div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div dir="ltr">is an oxymoron.</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>What, then, would you call this area:</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><a href="https://goo.gl/maps/b1gJHSyu2iwWPeWi9"
moz-do-not-send="true">https://goo.gl/maps/b1gJHSyu2iwWPeWi9</a></div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Currently mapped as:</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><a href="https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/434318204"
moz-do-not-send="true">https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/434318204</a></div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>It is not original, virgin, natural scrub as it was all
planted to stabilise the sand dunes along the beach, but
since then, it's basically been left to re-shoot naturally,
although Council do trim trees that come across the path,
& also remove weeds, but I'm still happy with
natural=scrub + leisure=nature_reserve as it's closed to the
general public to prevent erosion. <br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>"Maintained"? That would depend on what we want to call
maintained? Is it neat & carefully trimmed? No. Are
branches lopped when necessary & weeds pulled? Yes.<br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>& also:</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><a href="https://goo.gl/maps/hj7UpiqKWYGXamHA7"
moz-do-not-send="true">https://goo.gl/maps/hj7UpiqKWYGXamHA7</a></div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>(Incidentally, since those images were taken, those
plants have all grown & filled out quite a bit, & a
few of them are very spiky, so I wouldn't try walking
through without a machete in hand!)</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>So what are they? Garden / hedge / scrub? Yes, they are
carefully maintained, but also, as you can see, not the same
plants repeated in a nice neat line.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>I'd once again call it natural=scrub, maintained=yes.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>
Thanks
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Graeme</div>
</div>
<br>
</div>
</div>
<br>
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<pre class="moz-quote-pre" wrap="">_______________________________________________
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</pre>
</blockquote>
<div class="moz-signature">-- <br>
Ing. Bert Van Opstal
Mobile: +256 782 304106
Email: <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:bert.araali.afritastic@gmail.com">bert.araali.afritastic@gmail.com</a></div>
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