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<div><br></div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div>Nov 8, 2021, 23:05 by georg2016@nurfuerspam.de:<br></div><blockquote class="tutanota_quote" style="border-left: 1px solid #93A3B8; padding-left: 10px; margin-left: 5px;"><div>Dear all,<br></div><div><br></div><div>on 2021-10-21 13:40, Mateusz Konieczny wrote:<br></div><blockquote><div>man_made is not for "structural structure like a building"<br></div><div><br></div><div>we use building=* for that<br></div></blockquote><div><br></div><div>When reading this bold claim I thought it's on very, very thin ice in<br></div><div>the sense our definitions for man_made and building are IMHO somewhat<br></div><div>unsuited to *clearly tell apart* between the two.<br></div><div><br></div><div>So I looked a little into that topic; some details (you may skip this<br></div><div>section): https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:building tells "a<br></div><div>building is a man-made structure with a roof, standing more or less<br></div><div>permanently in one place". Okay.<br></div><div>https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:man_made lists e.g.<br></div><div>* lighthouse. It even contains the term "house" in the name and people<br></div><div>use(d) to live in many of them! It has a roof and all characteristics of<br></div><div>a building. Still, we don't have a building value for them.<br></div></blockquote><div dir="auto">that is because lighthouse (emitter of light) and lighthouse building<br></div><div dir="auto">can exist independently<br></div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">Lighthouse buildings are mapped as building=*<br></div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">See say <a href="https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/266318886" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/266318886</a> or other<br></div><div dir="auto">mapped ones.<br></div><blockquote class="tutanota_quote" style="border-left: 1px solid #93A3B8; padding-left: 10px; margin-left: 5px;"><div>* dovecote. Even the picture in the wiki shows an object having a roof<br></div><div>and looking very much like a building and matching the definition of a<br></div><div>building. So why is it in man_made? Moreover, it's for an extremely<br></div><div>similar purpose like a cowshed, stable or sty - but still, it is<br></div><div>classified as a completely type of entity...hard to see this as consistent.<br></div></blockquote><div dir="auto">No idea about this one.<br></div><blockquote class="tutanota_quote" style="border-left: 1px solid #93A3B8; padding-left: 10px; margin-left: 5px;"><div dir="auto">* bridge. For bridges with a roof - excepted for skywalks - we don't<br></div><div>have a building value despite they are meeting the definition, like e.g.<br></div><div>https://vietnam.de/wp-content/uploads/sites/4/2016/04/VIE_2011_1JEH_Bruecke_2618_5d2-2.jpg<br></div><div> Same story with goods_conveyor, pier, etc.<br></div></blockquote><div dir="auto">pier and goods conveyor, at least to me is not <br></div><div dir="auto">"structural structure like a building"<br></div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">No idea about this bridge, I have not really encountered objects like this.<br></div><blockquote class="tutanota_quote" style="border-left: 1px solid #93A3B8; padding-left: 10px; margin-left: 5px;"><div>* crane. https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oestricher_Kran has a roof, looks<br></div><div>like a building and fulfills definition of building. Again, we don't<br></div><div>have a building value for them.<br></div></blockquote><div dir="auto">building=industrial ? Either way, building=yes would be typically<br></div><div dir="auto">sufficient. We have not yet building values for many things, which are<br></div><div dir="auto">often mapped building=yes and clearly are buildings.<br></div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">In many cases there are clearly good option better than building=yes<br></div><div dir="auto">I just created <a href="https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:building%3Dlighthouse" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:building%3Dlighthouse</a><br></div><blockquote class="tutanota_quote" style="border-left: 1px solid #93A3B8; padding-left: 10px; margin-left: 5px;"><div dir="auto"> Same for communications_tower. Even the<br></div><div>picture in the wiki shows a tower having a roofed & enclosed story and<br></div><div>thus meeting building definition, many other communication towers like<br></div><div>https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Berliner_Fernsehturm fulfill the<br></div><div>definition of a building even more clearly, but we don't have a building<br></div><div>value for them. Similar for gasometer, monitoring_station, observatory,<br></div><div>offshore_platform, reservoir_covered, silo, storage_tank,<br></div><div>street_cabinet, stupa, watermill, etc.<br></div></blockquote><div dir="auto">street_cabinet is definitely not a building, building=silo is controversial<br></div><div dir="auto">but there are over 33 000 of them in use - <br></div><div dir="auto"><a target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer" href="https://taginfo.openstreetmap.org/tags/building=silo">https://taginfo.openstreetmap.org/tags/building=silo</a><br></div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">And <a target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer" href="https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/556435241">https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/556435241</a> ( Berliner Fernsehturm )<br></div><div dir="auto">is marked with building=yes<br></div><blockquote class="tutanota_quote" style="border-left: 1px solid #93A3B8; padding-left: 10px; margin-left: 5px;"><div>Conclusion:<br></div><div>For all of these man_made values, we do not use building=* despite<br></div><div>building definition is fulfilled. <br></div></blockquote><div dir="auto">Definitely not for all of them. I have not made full review of all this claims but <br></div><div dir="auto">not all of them are actually matching OSM mapping.<br></div><blockquote class="tutanota_quote" style="border-left: 1px solid #93A3B8; padding-left: 10px; margin-left: 5px;"><div dir="auto">To me, it seems we did<br></div><div>really mess up these 2 keys. IMHO changing the definitions so they do<br></div><div>exactly match the current values _and_ be easy to understand will be<br></div><div>impossible.<br></div></blockquote><div dir="auto">Oh I agree. highway=road, highway=unclassified are other example<br></div><div dir="auto">and I even started <a href="https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Counterintuitive_key_names" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Counterintuitive_key_names</a> <br></div><div dir="auto"><br></div> </body>
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