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<div><br></div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div>Apr 3, 2022, 01:46 by dieterdreist@gmail.com:<br></div><blockquote class="tutanota_quote" style="border-left: 1px solid #93A3B8; padding-left: 10px; margin-left: 5px;"><div><br></div><div><br></div><div>sent from a phone<br></div><blockquote><div>On 3 Apr 2022, at 00:47, Mateusz Konieczny via Tagging <tagging@openstreetmap.org> wrote:<br></div><div><br></div><div>But I tried to fix some structural issues on Wikidata<br></div><div>in past and it was not easy, and I am not planning to <br></div><div>spend my time on it.<br></div></blockquote><div><br></div><div><br></div><div>this is also my experience, it is very complicated to fix wikidata, first you have to find what is already there, often different items which are partly overlapping, and you would have to somehow merge or link them, or create meta items which link them. There is also the issue that you can only have one wikipedia article for every item, and IIRR you can also have the same wikipedia article only once in wikidata.<br></div><div>For example in OpenStreetMap there is a distinction between place as a socio geographic object and administrative entities, in wikipedia both concepts usually or often are treated in the same article (this is less relevant for wikidata on tag pages, but demonstrates the kind of problems you run into, and is relevant when you want to link OpenStreetMap data to wikidata). Wikidata is easy when you deal with persons, e.g. find all women painters of the 19th century, because it is clear what is one person, but it is less clear when it comes to geographic and political entities, where the notion what they are or what is meant change and can be ambiguous. What is “Rome”, a city? A municipality? A province like area with a special status? Is the Vatican city part of it? Politically it is not currently, culturally it is. <br></div><div><br></div><div>Another example for the city realm: in wikidata, the city of westminster is an instance of a city, in OpenStreetMap it is not. What is your suggestion how this could be fixed?<br></div><div><br></div><div>Maybe everything can be fixed, but from an OpenStreetMap perspective, wikidata is often a mess, specifically for geographic entities, and we are here to enjoy mapping in osm, not to loose our time in an uphill battle with wikidata bots. Adding “instance of” properties to wikidata objects has an infinite complexity, you could follow link after link, and reflect about the meaning, and maybe also refrain from adding the link, or not because tomorrow some bot will come along and add it without hesitation anyway ;)<br></div><div><br></div><div>I am all open to let people link wikidata and OpenStreetMap, but these are really just hints for loosely related concepts, and every measure to avoid the misconception that we are looking at the exact same thing is welcome, therefore I support Mateusz’ initiative to remove wikidata from the infoboxes, while retaining the link somewhere less prominent.<br></div></blockquote><div dir="auto">In general, it is much easier to fix blatantly wrong data in OSM than <br></div><div dir="auto">in Wikidata.<br></div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">For further complexity (for people who can easily fix issues listed above):<br></div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">- there is some structure ( <a href="https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q220" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q220</a> representing Rome,<br></div><div dir="auto">of type "big city" and "border city" and "abolished municipality in Italy" among other,<br></div><div dir="auto">last one is represented by "abolished municipality in Italy" at <br></div><div dir="auto"><a href="https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q3685476" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q3685476</a> )<br></div><div dir="auto">I tried to use such structure, ended with plenty of trouble which I tried to monitor/control<br></div><div dir="auto">with <a href="https://github.com/matkoniecz/wikibrain/blob/master/test_wikidata_structure.py" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">https://github.com/matkoniecz/wikibrain/blob/master/test_wikidata_structure.py</a><br></div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">For example <a href="https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q3720557" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q3720557</a> (train line) was classified as<br></div><div dir="auto">event, Maria columns were classified as events<br></div><div dir="auto">( <span class=""><a href="https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?title=Wikidata:Project_chat&oldid=1359739358#How_to_prevent_Maria_column_from_being_classified_as_a_process">https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?title=Wikidata:Project_chat&oldid=1359739358#How_to_prevent_Maria_column_from_being_classified_as_a_process</a>?</span> )<br></div><div dir="auto">and they may still be (I stopped fixing such issues as people were restoring<br></div><div dir="auto">classification that was classifying wooden churches as events and so on)<br></div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">- there is Cebuano Wikipedia which is almost entirely generated automatically<br></div><div dir="auto">by someone running bots (over 6 million articles).<br></div><div dir="auto">Someone else run bot on Wikidata and created Wikidata entries for all of them<br></div><div dir="auto">Noone bothered to ensure that this Wikidata entries are not duplicating already existing<br></div><div dir="auto">ones.<br></div><div dir="auto">Now editors are expected to deduplicate millions of entries.<br></div><div dir="auto">Such approach to bots (almost exact opposite to OSM) is typical.<br></div><div dir="auto">And while fixing individual duplicates is easy (with merge tool which can be enabled in<br></div><div dir="auto">gadgets in preferences), just Cebuano bots create millions of them.<br></div> </body>
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