Re: Tags for bike-friendly streets.<br>
<br>
Thanks for your input. We're going to go with Richard's suggestion to<br>
stick with the verifiable tags like maxspeed and traffic:hourly. We<br>
would also support the use of the proposed shoulder tag<br>
(<a href="http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Shoulder" target="_blank">http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Shoulder</a>), but obviously that<br>
hasn't been approved by the community so if you'd like to hold off on<br>
applying it, that's fine.<br>
<div><br>
Here's the temporary URL for the Brisbane project, in case you want to<br>
spread the word to get OSM bicyclists improving the data:<br>
<a href="http://www.ridethecity.com/?region=brisbane" target="_blank">http://www.ridethecity.com/?region=brisbane</a><br>
<br>
</div>We're in the process of making some of these changes ourselves and<br>
would welcome any and all assistance! Useful corrections would be:<br>
- adding or correcting street and track/cycleway names<br>
<div>- adding bike facilities where needed/missing<br>
</div>- correcting highway types e.g. residential vs. primary, secondary, etc.<br>
- specifying incline=* e.g. incline=9% or incline=-9% where there are<br>
steep hills<br>
- ensuring nodes connect highways to cycleways in the right places<br>
(and that nodes don't exist where connections should not exist)<br>
- correctly tagging highways and tracks with bicycle=no where bikes<br>
aren't allowed (and where it's not obvious).<br>
<br>
Our routing system does not refresh from OSM immediately. Initially<br>
we'll refresh every few days and as it becomes more stable, we'll<br>
probably refresh once a week.<br>
<br>
Thanks,<br>Vaidila & Jordan<br><br><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Tue, Sep 21, 2010 at 7:00 AM, <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:talk-au-request@openstreetmap.org" target="_blank">talk-au-request@openstreetmap.org</a>></span> wrote:<br>
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Today's Topics:<br>
<br>
1. Re: Tags for bicycle friendly streets (Ride the City -<br>
Brisbane) (Emilie Laffray)<br>
2. Re: Tags for bicycle friendly streets (Ride the City -<br>
Brisbane) (Richard Fairhurst)<br>
3. Re: Tags for bicycle friendly streets (Ride the City -<br>
Brisbane) (Ben Kelley)<br>
<br>
<br>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<br>
<br>
Message: 1<br>
Date: Mon, 20 Sep 2010 12:59:00 +0100<br>
From: Emilie Laffray <<a href="mailto:emilie.laffray@gmail.com" target="_blank">emilie.laffray@gmail.com</a>><br>
To: Lachlan Rogers <<a href="mailto:lachlan@rogers.name" target="_blank">lachlan@rogers.name</a>><br>
Cc: <a href="mailto:talk-au@openstreetmap.org" target="_blank">talk-au@openstreetmap.org</a><br>
Subject: Re: [talk-au] Tags for bicycle friendly streets (Ride the<br>
City - Brisbane)<br>
Message-ID:<br>
<<a href="mailto:AANLkTinxO0LjYD59cQJEbi_XD2Oi8NzPFsyYnzZHXDbo@mail.gmail.com" target="_blank">AANLkTinxO0LjYD59cQJEbi_XD2Oi8NzPFsyYnzZHXDbo@mail.gmail.com</a>><br>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"<br>
<br>
On 20 September 2010 11:39, Lachlan Rogers <<a href="mailto:lachlan@rogers.name" target="_blank">lachlan@rogers.name</a>> wrote:<br>
<br>
><br>
> I've seen a few similar proposals come and go. Where did<br>
>> "cyclerating=*" come from - did you just invent it? It would be much<br>
>> better to combine forces with at least one existing proposal if<br>
>> possible...<br>
>><br>
><br>
> The idea would be a good one in Canberra. I'd be happy to use the proposed<br>
> "cyclerating" tag, but would also be interested in reading about some of the<br>
> other proposals. Where can I find them?<br>
><br>
<br>
I would suggest talking about it internationally as one website<br>
<a href="http://www.geovelo.fr" target="_blank">www.geovelo.fr</a> is already using some similar concepts through not tagging. I<br>
am sure they would be happy to have a coherent proposal put into place. Just<br>
be aware that you will probably run into some discussion on tagging about<br>
the relativeness of that kind of tagging i.e. like the smoothness debate.<br>
It is likely to be a highly contentious proposal idea.<br>
<br>
Emilie Laffray<br>
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Message: 2<br>
Date: Mon, 20 Sep 2010 05:31:18 -0700 (PDT)<br>
From: Richard Fairhurst <<a href="mailto:richard@systemed.net" target="_blank">richard@systemed.net</a>><br>
To: <a href="mailto:talk-au@openstreetmap.org" target="_blank">talk-au@openstreetmap.org</a><br>
Subject: Re: [talk-au] Tags for bicycle friendly streets (Ride the<br>
City - Brisbane)<br>
Message-ID: <<a href="mailto:1284985878337-5550245.post@n2.nabble.com" target="_blank">1284985878337-5550245.post@n2.nabble.com</a>><br>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8<br>
<br>
<br>
Vaidila Kungys wrote:<br>
> We would like to ask you to tag any street with the following ratings<br>
> so that we have more information for better routing. These ratings<br>
> should be based upon your preference and experience of the streets:<br>
<br>
Please please please please don't do this.<br>
<br>
OSM tags are meant to be impartial and verifiable. Subjective ratings don't<br>
work: a "1" for a hardened city commuter ("hey, this street?lets me get to<br>
work faster, and there are no awkward cycle facilities to negotiate") might<br>
be a "5" for a novice cyclist.<br>
<br>
As an example, I'm an area ranger for the National Cycle Network over here<br>
in Oxfordshire (UK) and we maintain a lovely set of leisure routes. I'd<br>
definitely rate them as 1. But if you search any UK cycling forum (for<br>
example, <a href="http://yacf.co.uk" target="_blank">yacf.co.uk</a> or the uk.rec.cycling newsgroup) you'll find a hard core<br>
of committed cyclists who feel that many NCN routes can be inconvenient and<br>
badly designed, and would rate them at 4 or 5. And so on. We've had this<br>
debate several times beforehand -<br>
<a href="http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Talk:Proposed_features/Cycleworth" target="_blank">http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Talk:Proposed_features/Cycleworth</a> is one<br>
example.<br>
<br>
You can, of course, create a 'mashup' by using OSM data as a base, and<br>
designing a website (or printed map) that superimposes your own subjective<br>
rankings on top. That's one way to go.<br>
<br>
The other (and best) way is to tag the individual factors within OSM which<br>
make a good route: surface, traffic levels, incidence of annoying traffic<br>
lights, etc. etc. Your routing or rendering setup can then juggle these to<br>
get an estimate of what's "cycle-friendly" according to your own preferred<br>
metrics. Traffic levels are hard to tag accurately, but in OSM, we iterate<br>
towards accuracy: so you could make an estimate (based on counting traffic<br>
in the other direction as you cycle along a road) of, say, 1000 vehicles per<br>
hour, and when someone comes up with a better methodology they'll correct<br>
it.<br>
<br>
cc:ed to the international tagging list.<br>
<br>
cheers<br>
Richard<br>
--<br>
View this message in context: <a href="http://gis.638310.n2.nabble.com/Tags-for-bicycle-friendly-streets-Ride-the-City-Brisbane-tp5528579p5550245.html" target="_blank">http://gis.638310.n2.nabble.com/Tags-for-bicycle-friendly-streets-Ride-the-City-Brisbane-tp5528579p5550245.html</a><br>
Sent from the Australia mailing list archive at Nabble.com.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
------------------------------<br>
<br>
Message: 3<br>
Date: Tue, 21 Sep 2010 06:45:43 +1000<br>
From: Ben Kelley <<a href="mailto:ben.kelley@gmail.com" target="_blank">ben.kelley@gmail.com</a>><br>
To: OSM Australian Talk List <<a href="mailto:talk-au@openstreetmap.org" target="_blank">talk-au@openstreetmap.org</a>><br>
Subject: Re: [talk-au] Tags for bicycle friendly streets (Ride the<br>
City - Brisbane)<br>
Message-ID:<br>
<<a href="mailto:AANLkTikrgEYYYrcWufspLYcqa_mAupZi4uitRLtv1avX@mail.gmail.com" target="_blank">AANLkTikrgEYYYrcWufspLYcqa_mAupZi4uitRLtv1avX@mail.gmail.com</a>><br>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"<br>
<br>
Hi.<br>
<br>
I don't know about other places in Australia, but for Sydney we are doing<br>
well simply to have marked cycle routes mapped at all.<br>
<br>
I thought the rating system was only proposed. Is it actually used for<br>
anything? i.e. Is there any routing system that uses it?<br>
<br>
- Ben Kelley.<br>
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