<div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr">On Tue, 21 Jan 2020 at 14:19, Sebastian S. <<a href="mailto:mapping@consebt.de">mapping@consebt.de</a>> wrote:<br></div><div class="gmail_quote"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">Hi, what is the view of tagging road shoulders and particularly when they have painted bicycle signs?<br><br>Motorways would be another candidate.<br></blockquote><div><br></div><div>I've seen a few different scenarios.</div><div><br></div><div>- a dedicate cycle lane (only used as a cyclelane, not an emergency shoulder) cycleway=lane + shoulder=no eg <a href="https://www.openstreetmap.org/edit#map=20/-33.81151/151.18789">https://www.openstreetmap.org/edit#map=20/-33.81151/151.18789</a></div><div>- a shoulder which doubles as a marked cycle lane (it's an emergency shoulder, but with markings to indicate bicycle use) (shouder=yes, cycleway=lane) eg <a href="https://www.openstreetmap.org/edit#map=20/-34.64938/150.84838">https://www.openstreetmap.org/edit#map=20/-34.64938/150.84838</a></div><div>- a shoulder which can be used by bicycles but has no bicycle markings or signage (shoulder=yes cycleway=no, bicycle=yes) eg <a href="https://www.openstreetmap.org/edit#map=20/-34.58996/150.60760">https://www.openstreetmap.org/edit#map=20/-34.58996/150.60760</a></div><div>- have both a cycle lane and a shoulder, though segregated by paint (cycleway=lane, shoulder=yes) - no way to distinguish this from case (2) eg. <a href="https://www.openstreetmap.org/edit#map=20/-33.43134/151.29444">https://www.openstreetmap.org/edit#map=20/-33.43134/151.29444</a></div><div><br></div><div>I admit though this can be subjective.</div><div><br></div><div>So my rule of thumb is if there is a painted marking for bicycles and it's separated from other traffic from paint then use cycleway=lane, you can also then consider if this is a road shoulder too and add shoulder=yes if so.</div><div><br></div></div></div><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Wed, 22 Jan 2020 at 14:30, Ian Sergeant <<a href="mailto:inas66%2Bosm@gmail.com">inas66+osm@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr">Hi, </div><div dir="ltr"><br></div><div dir="ltr">Shoulders should always be tagged appropriately.</div><div dir="ltr"><div><br></div><div>Shoulders legally in Australia can be used by all bicycles - whether or not they have a bicycle stencil (painted bicycle sign) And a bicycle lane is legally indicated by a sign and not a stencil. Legally the stencil has no meaning at all.</div></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div><div>My view is we should be tagging based on the effective feature on the ground, and not solely based on if it meets a specific legal classification. So while legally it might need to meet certain crieteria to be an official "cycle lane" so long as it's dedicated for use by bicycles and separated from other traffic, it's effectively a cycleway=lane in OSM.</div><div> <br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div>My personal advice currently in Australia is to caution against indicating there is bicycle infrastructure where there is no amenity. Since, this is a far greater problem in OSM than missing cycle routes and infrastructure, and takes far longer to correct and survey. Google Maps has actually come from behind to lead OSM in this aspect now in Sydney in most areas.<br></div></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div><div>Are there any places in particular you think we are lacking? I've been working hard to add new recently built infrastructure and well as remove cycle tags from OSM where there is nothing left on the ground anymore.</div><div> </div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div>That said, most motorways that have a wide shoulder, a cycle stencil, and permit cycling have a bicycle lane indicated. I think this is probably appropriate.<br></div><div><br></div><div>Ian.</div></div><div><br></div><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Tue, 21 Jan 2020 at 14:19, Sebastian S. <<a href="mailto:mapping@consebt.de" target="_blank">mapping@consebt.de</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">Hi, what is the view of tagging road shoulders and particularly when they have painted bicycle signs?<br><br>Motorways would be another candidate.<br><br>A wiki entry for shoulder exists but is very basic <a href="https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:shoulder" target="_blank">https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:shoulder</a>_______________________________________________<br>
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