<html xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:w="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:m="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/2004/12/omml" xmlns="http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-html40"><head><meta http-equiv=Content-Type content="text/html; charset=utf-8"><meta name=Generator content="Microsoft Word 15 (filtered medium)"><style><!--
/* Font Definitions */
@font-face
{font-family:"Cambria Math";
panose-1:2 4 5 3 5 4 6 3 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:Calibri;
panose-1:2 15 5 2 2 2 4 3 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:Consolas;
panose-1:2 11 6 9 2 2 4 3 2 4;}
/* Style Definitions */
p.MsoNormal, li.MsoNormal, div.MsoNormal
{margin:0cm;
font-size:11.0pt;
font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;}
a:link, span.MsoHyperlink
{mso-style-priority:99;
color:blue;
text-decoration:underline;}
pre
{mso-style-priority:99;
mso-style-link:"HTML Preformatted Char";
margin:0cm;
margin-bottom:.0001pt;
font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:"Courier New";}
span.HTMLPreformattedChar
{mso-style-name:"HTML Preformatted Char";
mso-style-priority:99;
mso-style-link:"HTML Preformatted";
font-family:Consolas;
mso-fareast-language:EN-AU;}
span.EmailStyle20
{mso-style-type:personal-reply;
font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;
color:windowtext;}
.MsoChpDefault
{mso-style-type:export-only;
font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;
mso-fareast-language:EN-US;}
@page WordSection1
{size:612.0pt 792.0pt;
margin:72.0pt 72.0pt 72.0pt 72.0pt;}
div.WordSection1
{page:WordSection1;}
--></style><!--[if gte mso 9]><xml>
<o:shapedefaults v:ext="edit" spidmax="1026" />
</xml><![endif]--><!--[if gte mso 9]><xml>
<o:shapelayout v:ext="edit">
<o:idmap v:ext="edit" data="1" />
</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body lang=EN-AU link=blue vlink=purple style='word-wrap:break-word'><div class=WordSection1><p class=MsoNormal><span style='mso-fareast-language:EN-US'>If there is a sign, then it’s =designated, not =yes<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='mso-fareast-language:EN-US'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div style='border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm'><p class=MsoNormal><b><span lang=EN-US>From:</span></b><span lang=EN-US> Adam Horan <ahoran@gmail.com> <br><b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, 5 October 2021 09:24<br><b>To:</b> Kim Oldfield <osm@oldfield.wattle.id.au>; OpenStreetMap-AU Mailing List <talk-au@openstreetmap.org><br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [talk-au] Cycling on Victorian paths<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal>Hi Kim,<o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal>highway = pedestrian is for pedestrianised roads/areas rather then footpaths/sidewalks/pavements for those I think the current tag is highway=footway.<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>bridleway isn't in use in Australia much for the path types we're discussing here.<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>I'd prefer a normal footpath to be<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>highway=footway - and no additional bicycle= or foot= tag, unless there's a sign specifically barring cycling in which case bicycle=no<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>Shared paths (the most common ones after a walking only path)<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>either<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>highway=footway + bicycle=yes (I prefer this one)<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>or<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>highway=cycleway and a foot=yes tag to make it clear (I don't prefer this one, but it's a mild preference)<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>This is mostly with a VIC perspective.<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>Adam<o:p></o:p></p></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal>On Mon, 4 Oct 2021 at 23:48, Kim Oldfield via Talk-au <<a href="mailto:talk-au@openstreetmap.org">talk-au@openstreetmap.org</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0cm'><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'>Hi Andrew and list,<br><br>How do we go about formalising these decisions? Is there a vote process, or does someone take it upon themselves to document in the wiki any consensus we reach on this list?<br><br>We should document in the wiki when to add bicycle= and foot= tags which duplicate the default values for highway=footway/cycleway? (As per Andrew's email below).<br><br>We should also decide on, and document the default access rules for various highway= values at <a href="https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/OSM_tags_for_routing/Access_restrictions#Australia" target="_blank">https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/OSM_tags_for_routing/Access_restrictions#Australia</a> and remove the "Not endorsed by the Australian OSM community (yet)." Currently these are mostly the same as "Wordwide", except:<br><br>highway=pedestrian - bicycle=yes. Sounds reasonable.<br>highway=bridleway - bicycle=yes, foot=yes. I don't know enough about bridleways in Australia to have an opinion on this.<br>highway=footway - currently bicycle=yes. This I think should be broken up by state to reflect the state laws for adults riding on the footway. In Victoria and NSW: bicycle=no. Is Queensland bicycle=yes? What about the other states?<br>These decisions should be replicated in the Australia or state relations with def:... tags so they can be found and used by routing engines.<o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal>On 4/10/21 10:14 pm, Andrew Harvey wrote:<o:p></o:p></p></div><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal>With my DWG hat on, to summarise it looks like Graeme, Tony, Thorsten, Kim all advocate for not blanket tagging bicycle=no to every normal footpath (for the record I also support this, an explicit bicycle=no can still be tagged where signage is indicating such). Matthew has pointed out cases where Sebastian / HighRouleur has added bicycle=no but Mapillary shows bicycle markings. Sebastian, unless all of this you've actually surveyed in person and confirmed that the situation has change recently (happy to be proven if this is the case, though I think it unlikely) then we should proceed to roll back your changes because it's evident it goes against the community wishes here and the bulk changes have brought in these errors.<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>Sebastian, thanks for joining our mailing list and engaging with this discussion, but due to the consensus indicated here would you be willing to work through and revert these changes you've made?<o:p></o:p></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><pre>_______________________________________________<o:p></o:p></pre><pre>Talk-au mailing list<o:p></o:p></pre><pre><a href="mailto:Talk-au@openstreetmap.org" target="_blank">Talk-au@openstreetmap.org</a><o:p></o:p></pre><pre><a href="https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au" target="_blank">https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au</a><o:p></o:p></pre></blockquote><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal>_______________________________________________<br>Talk-au mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Talk-au@openstreetmap.org" target="_blank">Talk-au@openstreetmap.org</a><br><a href="https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au" target="_blank">https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au</a><o:p></o:p></p></blockquote></div></div></body></html>