<html>
<head>
<meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html;
charset=windows-1252">
</head>
<body>
<p><br>
</p>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 29/10/21 3:58 pm, Phil Wyatt wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:009201d7cc81$a972f5d0$fc58e170$@wyatt-family.com">
<meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html;
charset=windows-1252">
<meta name="Generator" content="Microsoft Word 15 (filtered
medium)">
<style>@font-face
{font-family:"Cambria Math";
panose-1:2 4 5 3 5 4 6 3 2 4;}@font-face
{font-family:Calibri;
panose-1:2 15 5 2 2 2 4 3 2 4;}@font-face
{font-family:Consolas;
panose-1:2 11 6 9 2 2 4 3 2 4;}p.MsoNormal, li.MsoNormal, div.MsoNormal
{margin:0cm;
font-size:11.0pt;
font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;
mso-fareast-language:EN-US;}a:link, span.MsoHyperlink
{mso-style-priority:99;
color:#0563C1;
text-decoration:underline;}span.EmailStyle19
{mso-style-type:personal-reply;
font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;
color:windowtext;}.MsoChpDefault
{mso-style-type:export-only;
font-size:10.0pt;}div.WordSection1
{page:WordSection1;}</style><!--[if gte mso 9]><xml>
<o:shapedefaults v:ext="edit" spidmax="1026" />
</xml><![endif]--><!--[if gte mso 9]><xml>
<o:shapelayout v:ext="edit">
<o:idmap v:ext="edit" data="1" />
</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]-->
<div class="WordSection1">
<p class="MsoNormal">Hi Folks,<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">In this case the user name of NTCA is a bit
of a hint. Took me a couple of minutes to find this group<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><a
href="https://www.facebook.com/nerangtrailcare/"
moz-do-not-send="true">https://www.facebook.com/nerangtrailcare/</a>
- Nerang Trail Care Alliance<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">In this case I would agree with the
deletions</p>
</div>
</blockquote>
<p><br>
</p>
<p>A trail local to me was closed off .. but still evident 'on the
ground'.</p>
<p>IIRC I market it disused:highway=* with access=no, I think that
removed it from most maps. OSMand now displays it .. if you look
for it, and that fairly well describes its appearance on the
ground. I am tempted to go abandoned:highway=* now some years
later if I have not already, it is now rather over grown at least
at the access points. I'll put it into OHM. <br>
</p>
<p>Another path has a 'track closed' sign on it .. but only on one
end. It is in frequent use by bicycle riders from the 'track
closed' end (down hill). I have removed a section on the map near
the sign, but it is there for any one to see on the ground. I
might have a word to the rangers, when they come to do some work
in my street next week, about it. I may know of at least one of
the riders using the track... I believe the fine is over $3,000. <br>
</p>
<p><br>
</p>
<p>My opinion: I disagree with deletions until it is gone - when it
cannot be seen. Tag it with what is in effect .. access=no
(signs?), disused:highway=* is fading due to lack of use/
revegetation. Possibly add the tag description=illegal/*.</p>
<p><br>
</p>
<p>While NTCA may have 'good intentions' the map is about what is
there not what might be wanted. <br>
</p>
<p><br>
</p>
<o:p></o:p>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:009201d7cc81$a972f5d0$fc58e170$@wyatt-family.com">
<div class="WordSection1">
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<div>
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1
1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
style="mso-fareast-language:EN-AU" lang="EN-US">From:</span></b><span
style="mso-fareast-language:EN-AU" lang="EN-US">
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:osm.talk-au@thorsten.engler.id.au">osm.talk-au@thorsten.engler.id.au</a>
<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:osm.talk-au@thorsten.engler.id.au"><osm.talk-au@thorsten.engler.id.au></a> <br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, 29 October 2021 2:05 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> 'OSM Australian Talk List'
<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:talk-au@openstreetmap.org"><talk-au@openstreetmap.org></a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [talk-au] "Removing closed or illegal
trails." (in Nerang National Park)<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><a
href="https://www.openstreetmap.org/changeset/112722497"
moz-do-not-send="true">https://www.openstreetmap.org/changeset/112722497</a><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">“Removing closed or illegal trails. Tidy up
of Fire Roads and places”<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">My opinion on the topic is:<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">If it exists on the ground, it gets mapped.
If there is no legal access, that's <span
style="font-family:Consolas">access=no</span> or <span
style="font-family:Consolas">access=private</span>. If it's
a path that has been created by traffic where it's not
officially meant to go, it's <span
style="font-family:Consolas">informal=yes</span>.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">That seems to be in line with the
previously established consensus on the list here: <a
href="https://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/talk-au/2019-September/012863.html"
moz-do-not-send="true">https://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/talk-au/2019-September/012863.html</a><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">I have no local knowledge of the area and
am not really invested in this one way or another, but I feel
that paths that verifiably physically exist on the ground
(which I assume these are) shouldn’t be simply deleted. If
access is legally prohibited in some way, then the tags should
reflect that, not the way simply being deleted.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">What’s the general opinion about this?<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Cheers,<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Thorsten<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<br>
<fieldset class="mimeAttachmentHeader"></fieldset>
<pre class="moz-quote-pre" wrap="">_______________________________________________
Talk-au mailing list
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:Talk-au@openstreetmap.org">Talk-au@openstreetmap.org</a>
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au">https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au</a>
</pre>
</blockquote>
</body>
</html>