<div dir="ltr"><div>Very interesting, thanks Mark!</div><div><br></div><div>While looking around, I'd spotted a few references that said they were, but by your extracts, it certainly appears they're not?</div><div><br></div><div>So, to get a definitive answer, I've just flicked an e-mail off to the Honours Directorate of the PM's Department!</div><div><br></div><div>We'll see what they have to say on the matter?</div><div><br></div><div><div><div dir="ltr" data-smartmail="gmail_signature"><div dir="ltr"><div><div dir="ltr">Thanks<div><br></div><div>Graeme</div></div></div></div></div></div><br></div></div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Mon, 13 Dec 2021 at 15:42, Mark Rattigan <<a href="mailto:mark@rattigan.id.au" target="_blank">mark@rattigan.id.au</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">I may be nit-picking, but (as I understand it) the Australian Aboriginal Flag and Torres Strait Islander Flag have been recognised as the flags of the Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander people of Australia and as flags of significance to the Australian nation and thus been appointed by proclamation of the Governor General as flags of the Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander peoples respectively, but NOT National Flags.<br>
<br>
<br>
The Flags Act 1953 <a href="https://www.legislation.gov.au/Latest/C2008C00376" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://www.legislation.gov.au/Latest/C2008C00376</a> declares only one National Flag - the 'blue flag"<br>
"The blue flag ... is declared to be the Australian National Flag."<br>
<br>
The Governor-General may, by Proclamation, appoint such other flags and ensigns of Australia as he thinks fit, and has done so as below:<br>
<br>
Proclamation under the Flags Act 1953 (Australian Aboriginal Flag): <a href="https://www.legislation.gov.au/Latest/F2008L00209" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://www.legislation.gov.au/Latest/F2008L00209</a><br>
"acting with the advice of the Federal Executive Council and noting the fact that the flag ... is recognised as the flag of the Aboriginal peoples of Australia and a flag of significance to the Australian nation generally, appoint that flag, ... to be the flag of the Aboriginal peoples of Australia and to be known as the Australian Aboriginal Flag..."<br>
<br>
Proclamation under the Flags Act 1953 (Torres Strait Islander Flag): <a href="https://www.legislation.gov.au/Latest/F2008L00210" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://www.legislation.gov.au/Latest/F2008L00210</a><br>
" acting with the advice of the Federal Executive Council and noting the fact that the flag ... is recognised as the flag of the Torres Strait Islander people of Australia and a flag of significance to the Australian nation generally, appoint that flag ... to be the flag of the Torres Strait Islander people of Australia and to be known as the Torres Strait Islander Flag..."<br>
<br>
<br>
The flags are undoubtedly of significance and represent their respective peoples, but they don't meet the description from the OSM wiki for flag:type=national being "the main civil flag of a nation", and have not been declared by the Flags Act 1953 to be such.<br>
<br>
I second the suggestion of flag:type=indigenous - none of the other already defined flag:types really fit.<br>
<br>
Cheers<br>
Mark<br>
<br>
> -----Original Message-----<br>
> From: <a href="mailto:talk-au-request@openstreetmap.org" target="_blank">talk-au-request@openstreetmap.org</a> <talk-au-<br>
> <a href="mailto:request@openstreetmap.org" target="_blank">request@openstreetmap.org</a>><br>
> Sent: Monday, 13 December 2021 3:31 PM<br>
> To: <a href="mailto:talk-au@openstreetmap.org" target="_blank">talk-au@openstreetmap.org</a><br>
> Subject: Talk-au Digest, Vol 174, Issue 13<br>
> <br>
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> Contents of Talk-au digest..."<br>
> <br>
> <br>
> Today's Topics:<br>
> <br>
> 1. Re: First Nations flags? (Graeme Fitzpatrick)<br>
> 2. Re: First Nations flags? (Graeme Fitzpatrick)<br>
> 3. Re: First Nations flags? (Warin)<br>
> 4. Re: First Nations flags? (Phil Wyatt)<br>
> <br>
> <br>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------<br>
> <br>
> Message: 1<br>
> Date: Mon, 13 Dec 2021 08:34:00 +1000<br>
> From: Graeme Fitzpatrick <<a href="mailto:graemefitz1@gmail.com" target="_blank">graemefitz1@gmail.com</a>><br>
> To: Andrew Davidson <<a href="mailto:theswavu@gmail.com" target="_blank">theswavu@gmail.com</a>>, OSM-Au<br>
> <<a href="mailto:talk-au@openstreetmap.org" target="_blank">talk-au@openstreetmap.org</a>><br>
> Subject: Re: [talk-au] First Nations flags?<br>
> Message-ID:<br>
> <CAP4zaXr8EBHOeyM9ZQLA0=CTFASH0GAg7Sg9EZAGcM2rpmoLDw@<br>
> <a href="http://mail.gmail.com" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">mail.gmail.com</a>><br>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"<br>
> <br>
> On Sun, 12 Dec 2021 at 17:23, Andrew Davidson <<a href="mailto:theswavu@gmail.com" target="_blank">theswavu@gmail.com</a>><br>
> wrote:<br>
> <br>
> ><br>
> > flag:name=Australian Aboriginal<br>
> > flag:wikidata=Q1285625<br>
> ><br>
> > flag:name=Torres Strait Islander<br>
> > flag:wikidata=Q462621<br>
> ><br>
> <br>
> Thanks for that info, Andrew.<br>
> <br>
> & after a bit more searching last night, it turns out that they have both been<br>
> proclaimed as Australian National Flags, which I wasn't aware of.<br>
> <br>
> It's going to be interesting to see how it works when / if flags start being<br>
> rendered?<br>
> <br>
> I'll update the Oz Guidelines to include this info.<br>
> <br>
> Thanks<br>
> <br>
> Graeme<br>
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> <br>
> ------------------------------<br>
> <br>
> Message: 2<br>
> Date: Mon, 13 Dec 2021 12:53:13 +1000<br>
> From: Graeme Fitzpatrick <<a href="mailto:graemefitz1@gmail.com" target="_blank">graemefitz1@gmail.com</a>><br>
> To: Andrew Davidson <<a href="mailto:theswavu@gmail.com" target="_blank">theswavu@gmail.com</a>>, OSM-Au<br>
> <<a href="mailto:talk-au@openstreetmap.org" target="_blank">talk-au@openstreetmap.org</a>><br>
> Subject: Re: [talk-au] First Nations flags?<br>
> Message-ID:<br>
> <CAP4zaXp54iiyf4TKfH0DS6doMPEUc7c3t_V8WLUdQoybB-<br>
> <a href="mailto:u3Ug@mail.gmail.com" target="_blank">u3Ug@mail.gmail.com</a>><br>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"<br>
> <br>
> On Mon, 13 Dec 2021 at 08:34, Graeme Fitzpatrick <<a href="mailto:graemefitz1@gmail.com" target="_blank">graemefitz1@gmail.com</a>><br>
> wrote:<br>
> <br>
> ><br>
> > I'll update the Oz Guidelines to include this info.<br>
> ><br>
> <br>
> & done:<br>
> <a href="https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Australian_Tagging_Guidelines#Australi" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Australian_Tagging_Guidelines#Australi</a><br>
> an_Flags<br>
> <br>
> Having troubles with the example images of the Aboriginal & Torres Strait<br>
> Islander flags though?<br>
> <br>
> They're both listed in Wikipedia<br>
> <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Australian_flags#Other_flags_recognise" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Australian_flags#Other_flags_recognise</a><br>
> d_under_the_Flags_Act_1953,<br>
> but when I tried to link to those images, it appears that they don't really exist?<br>
> <br>
> Could somebody who actually knows what they're doing around the wiki<br>
> please have a look at them? :-)<br>
> <br>
> Thanks<br>
> <br>
> Graeme<br>
> -------------- next part --------------<br>
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> <br>
> ------------------------------<br>
> <br>
> Message: 3<br>
> Date: Mon, 13 Dec 2021 14:50:12 +1100<br>
> From: Warin <<a href="mailto:61sundowner@gmail.com" target="_blank">61sundowner@gmail.com</a>><br>
> To: <a href="mailto:talk-au@openstreetmap.org" target="_blank">talk-au@openstreetmap.org</a><br>
> Subject: Re: [talk-au] First Nations flags?<br>
> Message-ID: <<a href="mailto:dfb9d54c-eb81-e230-3e34-99dff7a647a6@gmail.com" target="_blank">dfb9d54c-eb81-e230-3e34-99dff7a647a6@gmail.com</a>><br>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"; Format="flowed"<br>
> <br>
> There is a claim of copyright ob the Aboriginal flag.. (foolish if you ask me)...<br>
> <br>
> Oh and also the Torres Strait Islander one too... (sigh)<br>
> <br>
> <br>
> Both are listed as copyright on wikipedia.<br>
> <br>
> So those are out for OSM?<br>
> <br>
> <br>
> On 13/12/21 1:53 pm, Graeme Fitzpatrick wrote:<br>
> ><br>
> ><br>
> ><br>
> > On Mon, 13 Dec 2021 at 08:34, Graeme Fitzpatrick<br>
> > <<a href="mailto:graemefitz1@gmail.com" target="_blank">graemefitz1@gmail.com</a> <mailto:<a href="mailto:graemefitz1@gmail.com" target="_blank">graemefitz1@gmail.com</a>>> wrote:<br>
> ><br>
> ><br>
> > I'll update the Oz Guidelines to include this info.<br>
> ><br>
> ><br>
> > & done:<br>
> > <a href="https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Australian_Tagging_Guidelines#Aust" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Australian_Tagging_Guidelines#Aust</a><br>
> > ralian_Flags<br>
> > <<a href="https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Australian_Tagging_Guidelines#Aus" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Australian_Tagging_Guidelines#Aus</a><br>
> > tralian_Flags><br>
> ><br>
> > Having troubles with the example images of the Aboriginal & Torres<br>
> > Strait Islander flags though?<br>
> ><br>
> > They're both listed in Wikipedia<br>
> > <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Australian_flags#Other_flags_rec" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Australian_flags#Other_flags_rec</a><br>
> > ognised_under_the_Flags_Act_1953<br>
> > <<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Australian_flags#Other_flags_re" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Australian_flags#Other_flags_re</a><br>
> > cognised_under_the_Flags_Act_1953>,<br>
> > but when I tried to link to those images, it appears that they don't<br>
> > really exist?<br>
> ><br>
> > Could somebody who actually knows what they're doing around the wiki<br>
> > please have a look at them? :-)<br>
> ><br>
> > ?Thanks<br>
> ><br>
> > Graeme<br>
> ><br>
> ><br>
> > _______________________________________________<br>
> > Talk-au mailing list<br>
> > <a href="mailto:Talk-au@openstreetmap.org" target="_blank">Talk-au@openstreetmap.org</a><br>
> > <a href="https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au</a><br>
> -------------- next part --------------<br>
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> <br>
> ------------------------------<br>
> <br>
> Message: 4<br>
> Date: Mon, 13 Dec 2021 15:30:20 +1100<br>
> From: "Phil Wyatt" <<a href="mailto:phil@wyatt-family.com" target="_blank">phil@wyatt-family.com</a>><br>
> To: "'Warin'" <<a href="mailto:61sundowner@gmail.com" target="_blank">61sundowner@gmail.com</a>>, <talk-<br>
> <a href="mailto:au@openstreetmap.org" target="_blank">au@openstreetmap.org</a>><br>
> Subject: Re: [talk-au] First Nations flags?<br>
> Message-ID: <004401d7efda$267b6910$73723b30$@<a href="http://wyatt-family.com" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">wyatt-family.com</a>><br>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"<br>
> <br>
> That?s correct on all fronts<br>
> <br>
> <a href="https://aiatsis.gov.au/explore/aboriginal-flag" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://aiatsis.gov.au/explore/aboriginal-flag</a><br>
> <br>
> <a href="https://aiatsis.gov.au/explore/torres-strait-islander-flag" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://aiatsis.gov.au/explore/torres-strait-islander-flag</a><br>
> <br>
> <a href="https://www.naidoc.org.au/about/indigenous-australian-flags" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://www.naidoc.org.au/about/indigenous-australian-flags</a><br>
> <br>
> <br>
> <br>
> Might have some luck with Torres Strait Island Regional Council in getting<br>
> permission to use<br>
> <br>
> <br>
> <br>
> From: Warin <<a href="mailto:61sundowner@gmail.com" target="_blank">61sundowner@gmail.com</a>><br>
> Sent: Monday, 13 December 2021 2:50 PM<br>
> To: <a href="mailto:talk-au@openstreetmap.org" target="_blank">talk-au@openstreetmap.org</a><br>
> Subject: Re: [talk-au] First Nations flags?<br>
> <br>
> <br>
> <br>
> There is a claim of copyright ob the Aboriginal flag.. (foolish if you ask me)...<br>
> <br>
> Oh and also the Torres Strait Islander one too... (sigh)<br>
> <br>
> <br>
> <br>
> Both are listed as copyright on wikipedia.<br>
> <br>
> So those are out for OSM?<br>
> <br>
> <br>
> <br>
> On 13/12/21 1:53 pm, Graeme Fitzpatrick wrote:<br>
> <br>
> <br>
> <br>
> <br>
> <br>
> <br>
> On Mon, 13 Dec 2021 at 08:34, Graeme Fitzpatrick <<a href="mailto:graemefitz1@gmail.com" target="_blank">graemefitz1@gmail.com</a><br>
> <mailto:<a href="mailto:graemefitz1@gmail.com" target="_blank">graemefitz1@gmail.com</a>> > wrote:<br>
> <br>
> <br>
> <br>
> I'll update the Oz Guidelines to include this info.<br>
> <br>
> <br>
> <br>
> & done:<br>
> <a href="https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Australian_Tagging_Guidelines#Australi" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Australian_Tagging_Guidelines#Australi</a><br>
> an_Flags<br>
> <br>
> <br>
> <br>
> Having troubles with the example images of the Aboriginal & Torres Strait<br>
> Islander flags though?<br>
> <br>
> <br>
> <br>
> They're both listed in Wikipedia<br>
> <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Australian_flags#Other_flags_recognise" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Australian_flags#Other_flags_recognise</a><br>
> d_under_the_Flags_Act_1953, but when I tried to link to those images, it<br>
> appears that they don't really exist?<br>
> <br>
> <br>
> <br>
> Could somebody who actually knows what they're doing around the wiki<br>
> please have a look at them? :-)<br>
> <br>
> <br>
> <br>
> Thanks<br>
> <br>
> <br>
> <br>
> Graeme<br>
> <br>
> <br>
> <br>
> <br>
> <br>
> <br>
> <br>
> _______________________________________________<br>
> Talk-au mailing list<br>
> <a href="mailto:Talk-au@openstreetmap.org" target="_blank">Talk-au@openstreetmap.org</a> <mailto:<a href="mailto:Talk-au@openstreetmap.org" target="_blank">Talk-au@openstreetmap.org</a>><br>
> <a href="https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au</a><br>
> <br>
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> Subject: Digest Footer<br>
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> <br>
> End of Talk-au Digest, Vol 174, Issue 13<br>
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