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<p>Thanks Kim and Phil.</p>
<p>I've updated the link to the one provided by Phil.<br /><br />I don't believe that we should be including the descriptions verbatim, even if we could: the actual grading system is a bit too complex to <a href="https://www.ffm.vic.gov.au/__data/assets/pdf_file/0019/21475/dse_trail_grade_brochure_tagged.pdf">https://www.ffm.vic.gov.au/__data/assets/pdf_file/0019/21475/dse_trail_grade_brochure_tagged.pdf</a> include on a single wiki page, and we probably don't want to encourage inaccurate tagging using an impartial definition. Plus it would be a big headache to try and keep the wiki aligned: it's much easier to provide a source to the authoritative definition.</p>
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<p>In re: Pump track, there isn't an established tag that would differentiate a pump track - happy to add one if there is a good candidate, of course. :)</p>
<p>In re: Bike Lanes and Street Cycling is trying to convey what you described, and is largely taken verbatim from the previous guidelines:</p>
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<p><span>Unfortunately, it is possible in Australia for a legally designated cycle facility to be completely unusable. A bicycle lane that is really a parking lane, or a shared path sign on a obstructed or even non-existent path. Mappers should use common sense and discretion, and map the effective facility that exists on the ground if it differs to what is defined by the Australian road rules.</span></p>
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<p>Essentially, follow what best describes what is actually on the ground - don't simply follow every sign. :)</p>
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<p id="reply-intro">On 2022-06-28 10:51, Phil Wyatt wrote:</p>
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<div class="pre" style="margin: 0; padding: 0; font-family: monospace">Hi Folks,<br /><br />This is probably the best reference for the AWTGS<br /><br /><a href="https://www.ffm.vic.gov.au/recreational-activities/walking-and-camping/australian-walking-track-grading-system" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">https://www.ffm.vic.gov.au/recreational-activities/walking-and-camping/australian-walking-track-grading-system</a><br /><br />Cheers - Phil<br /><br />-----Original Message-----<br />From: Kim Oldfield via Talk-au <<a href="mailto:talk-au@openstreetmap.org">talk-au@openstreetmap.org</a>> <br />Sent: Tuesday, 28 June 2022 8:21 PM<br />To: Dian Ågesson <<a href="mailto:me@diacritic.xyz">me@diacritic.xyz</a>><br />Cc: <a href="mailto:talk-au@openstreetmap.org">talk-au@openstreetmap.org</a><br />Subject: Re: [talk-au] OSM Wiki Cleanup Update: 6th Tagging Guidelines Page ready<br /><br />Hi Dian,<br /><br />The AWTGS page referenced isn't much use. As a trail user it doesn't tell me if 1 is easy or hard.<br /><br />Searching for other references I found<br /><a href="https://www.nationalparks.nsw.gov.au/safety/bushwalking-safety/australian-walking-track-grading-system" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">https://www.nationalparks.nsw.gov.au/safety/bushwalking-safety/australian-walking-track-grading-system</a><br /><a href="https://naturetrail.com.au/australian-walking-track-grading-system/" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">https://naturetrail.com.au/australian-walking-track-grading-system/</a><br /><a href="https://www.parks.vic.gov.au/things-to-do/hiking-and-bushwalking/choose-the-right-hike/how-walking-tracks-are-rated" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">https://www.parks.vic.gov.au/things-to-do/hiking-and-bushwalking/choose-the-right-hike/how-walking-tracks-are-rated</a><br /><br />all of which use almost identical descriptions and symbols for grades 1 to 5. Does anyone know what the source for this is, and if we are allowed to include the descriptions verbatim in wiki.osm?<br /><br />Is Pump track missing a key=value pair in the Value column? <br />bicycle=designated by its self doesn't imply pump track.<br /><br />The "Bike Lanes and Street Cycling" section is vague. What does "map according to what is on the ground, rather than relying on technical, legal definitions" mean? Isn't what is signposted on the ground what the legal definition is? Given that many signposted bike lanes and trails in Australia are not fit for purpose (eg they have parked cars in them or cyclist dismount signs) I don't know how they can be tagged in a consistent and useful manner.<br /><br />The rest of the page looks good.<br /><br />Kim<br /><br />On 26/6/22 22:02, Dian Ågesson wrote:
<blockquote type="cite" style="padding: 0 0.4em; border-left: #1010ff 2px solid; margin: 0"><br />Hello,<br /><br />The sixth subpage of the Australian Tagging Guidelines: <br /><a href="https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Australian_Tagging_Guidelines/Cycl" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Australian_Tagging_Guidelines/Cycl</a><br />ing_and_Foot_Paths<br />is ready for review.<br /><br />This page took a significant amount of effort, as there is ongoing <br />discussions, conflicting global guidelines, and the previous content <br />was quite out of date. This is also likely to be the subpage with the <br />most controversy, so I would strongly encourage contributions and <br />feedback from all.<br /><br />Please, as always, don't be shy about providing feedback or raising <br />concerns. There are only one subpages to go with the Tagging <br />Guidelines pages: Utilities and Infrastructure.<br /><br />Dian<br /><br /><br />_______________________________________________<br />Talk-au mailing list<br /><a href="mailto:Talk-au@openstreetmap.org">Talk-au@openstreetmap.org</a><br /><a href="https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au</a></blockquote>
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