<div dir="ltr"><br><div class="gmail_extra"><br><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Tue, Apr 16, 2013 at 6:46 AM, Jo <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:winfixit@gmail.com" target="_blank">winfixit@gmail.com</a>></span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr"><div><div>I thought the consensus was that we repeat addr:street for each house but not the other information like addr:city, addr:postcode, addr:country and whatnot. Imagine what happens to the size of the DB (and all its derivatives like the planet files), if everybody starts doing that for each and every house/address in the world!<br>
</div>Potlatch has its limitations, but by choosing to work with it, people indicate a willingness to live with those limitations. I can only hope the IDeditor will overcome those limitations one day and that all Potlatch users will migrate towards it when it does.<span class="HOEnZb"><font color="#888888"><br>
<br></font></span></div><span class="HOEnZb"><font color="#888888">Jo<br></font></span></div><div class="HOEnZb"><div class="h5"><div class="gmail_extra"><br></div></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div><div style>+1 We should not map for the renderer, nor for the (simpliest) editor. </div>
<div style>+1 also on not repeating the same data over and over.</div><div style><br></div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div> </div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div class="HOEnZb"><div class="h5"><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">2013/4/16 Marc Gemis <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:marc.gemis@gmail.com" target="_blank">marc.gemis@gmail.com</a>></span><br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div dir="ltr">I use most of these plugins. But recently I started using them less, because now I convert my GPX waypoints to OSM data points automatically. <div><br></div><div>The only thing I do not do is repeating the postal code over and over, but since you insist, I'll do that from now on. :-)<div>
<br></div><div>Can you look at e.g. <a href="http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=51.16279363632202&lon=4.425258636474609&zoom=16" target="_blank">http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=51.16279363632202&lon=4.425258636474609&zoom=16</a> an area I mapped this winter. Please let me know if you think it can be improved. Yes, the city and the postal code are only in the relation.</div>
<div><br></div><div>Yes, I know I should use building=house more consistently. Yes, I know I could add sidewalk, lit, parking lane tags as I did (already partially) in <a href="http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=51.134501695632935&lon=4.385626316070557&zoom=16" target="_blank">http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=51.134501695632935&lon=4.385626316070557&zoom=16</a></div>
<div><br></div><div>Let me know if you think the data can be improved, as I'm willing to improve my tagging habits.</div><div><br></div><div>regards</div><span><font color="#888888"><div><br></div><div>
m</div>
<div><br></div></font></span></div></div><div><div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Mon, Apr 15, 2013 at 10:55 PM, Glenn Plas <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:glenn@byte-consult.be" target="_blank">glenn@byte-consult.be</a>></span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div text="#000000" bgcolor="#FFFFFF">
<div>It doesn't matter where they are , you
still have to put those tags on a relation, so they better be in
the correct city to start with ... Wrong postal codes, wrong
city.... I would rather _NOT_ have wrong ones than the 'close
enough for me' type of data. My point was introducing wrong
data.... I admit I'm not a fan of the associatedStreet relation.
I just recently learned it makes it even easier for some to f#ck
up my work by 'correcting' a streetRelation that wasn't broken.
Now it's even more easy to destroy 'en mass' in a single mouse
click.<br>
<br>
There are some amazing josm plugins (Address plugin, adress mapcss
etc) to help you do this without pain. We are all repeating
'building=yes' on a building, it's not because we put millions of
this on the map that this tag get's to be valued less now than
before? It's because it's needed and gives useful info. Why
would your thoughts be any different for the addr:street tag that
carry much more useful info than a mere 'building=yes'. So no, I
don't think we are 'repeating' data, we are detailing it as such
...<br>
<br>
I sometimes believe I'm the only one in Belgium using OSM data in
a non-mapping fashion like geocoding.<br>
<br>
There are working JOSM plugins that make sure you'll never ever
have to type the streetname, you just select the named road + addr
node + building and press = shift-T<br>
<br>
See the Terracer plugin.
<a href="http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/JOSM/Plugins/Terracer" target="_blank">http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/JOSM/Plugins/Terracer</a><br>
<br>
But also, the FixAddresses plugin.
<a href="http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/JOSM/Plugins/FixAddresses" target="_blank">http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/JOSM/Plugins/FixAddresses</a> <br>
<br>
I just wished it supported AssociatedStreet relations, same goes
for some of the finer mapCSS I see. I combined them all, and this
gives me powerful view on the address situation in the target
area.<br>
<br>
<a href="http://josm.openstreetmap.de/josmfile?page=Styles/AddressValidator&style" target="_blank">http://josm.openstreetmap.de/josmfile?page=Styles/AddressValidator&style</a><br>
<a href="https://github.com/simon04/coloured-addresses.mapcss/raw/master/dist/coloured-addresses.mapcss" target="_blank">https://github.com/simon04/coloured-addresses.mapcss/raw/master/dist/coloured-addresses.mapcss</a><br>
<a href="http://josm.openstreetmap.de/josmfile?page=Styles/Noname&style" target="_blank">http://josm.openstreetmap.de/josmfile?page=Styles/Noname&style</a><br>
<br>
try them, you'll love the colors per street, very nice to spot
problems on corners.<span><font color="#888888"><br>
<br>
Glenn</font></span><div><div><br>
<br>
<br>
On 04/15/2013 07:33 PM, Marc Gemis wrote:<br>
</div></div></div><div><div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div dir="ltr">Your complain about street being placed in wrong
cities, is exactly why we should use associatedStreet relations
instead of repeating addr:street & addr:city over and over
on individual buildings. In that case you only have to correct
it once, on the relation, and the data is corrected.
<div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>But I'll admit that I've been to lazy to add
associatedStreets recently, as nobody seems to care. And the
tools support outside JOSM is not that great. Repeating the
street name twice is completely useless IMHO.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>I think it is possible to combine lot's of house
numbers and accuracy, at least I hope that's what I leave
behind :-)</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>m</div>
<div><br>
</div>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
</div>
<div class="gmail_extra"><br>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">On Mon, Apr 15, 2013 at 5:48 PM, Glenn
Plas <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:glenn@byte-consult.be" target="_blank">glenn@byte-consult.be</a>></span>
wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div text="#000000" bgcolor="#FFFFFF">
<div>
<div>On 04/15/2013 02:38 PM, JorenDC wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite">Hi, <br>
<br>
In December there was a thread (start: <a href="http://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/talk-be/2012-December/003367.html" target="_blank">http://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/talk-be/2012-December/003367.html</a>)
containing some numbers/stats. <br>
<br>
@Sander, *: is it possible to share your used method
to pull these stats (or just pull them again) and
publish them on a 'frequent' base (I'm not saying
weekly, but what about +/- every 4 moths or so)? In
that way we can see a bit of our progress regarding
this 'project'. <br>
</blockquote>
</div>
The method (overpass query) is mentioned in that link
thread (Jo points it out). On the subject..... I've been
mapping a lot of housenumbers lately, verifying my data
against AGIV data before committing to OSM... I can only
conclude there is much work to be done, AGIV is far from
recent concerning new built houses, and OSM itself has
lots of issues regarding accuracy.<br>
<br>
I'm not too sure on the scientific significance of such a
statistic either. I would more than love to see stats
that compair quality of the entered addresses.
(completeness , including postal code and other addr:*
tags, number of corrections etc. ) I've been correcting
a lot of mistakes and I start seeing a negative tendancy
in it:<br>
<br>
The ones that have done a LOT of input but didn't care to
quality check (validating even!) what they entered. I'll
state this: I'm cleaning up far too much crap others
leave behind, I'm far from perfect in my housenumbering
too in this small village it's still a huge undertaking,
especially on complex corners where some numbers of the
same building belong to a different street. I have houses
I've changed 3 times in a row after visiting.<br>
<br>
Moreover, I see some people tagging the next city name on
a street, probably because they think it's in the next
city, but OSM shouldn't be a guessing game or a race to
enter the most addresses if that info is wrong.<br>
<br>
If someone has such an overpass query, I'm more than
interested to see those results, the rest looks like
bragging rights.<br>
<br>
The AGIV site is valuable , even though it's slow. It's
great tool to verify what city a certain street belongs
to. for example : <a href="http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=50.998941&lon=4.426396&zoom=18&layers=M" target="_blank">http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=50.998941&lon=4.426396&zoom=18&layers=M</a><br>
<br>
De "Kleine Parijsstraat" belongs to Zemst, not Mechelen.
If you look this up in nominatim, it will tell you it's in
Mechelen, which is totally wrong. You will not find this
street using AGIV in Mechelen. But someone decided this
was Hombeek(Mechelen) instead. So the borders of Zemst
where wrong as well as this was used to determine
these. The street above that "Boterstraat" can be found
in Mechelen, not in Zemst. Thanks to AGIV, I'm more
certain when those cases present. ( You can still see the
old cached tile in some zoom levels)<br>
<br>
But then again, I saw AGIV containing WRONG housenumbers
too. Verification in the field (twice) confirmed that
what I had in mind was matching reality. So it's like a
triple check: a) know the place b) visit it c) check with
AGIV d) map a decent hous e) be complete, using the
plugins to add Country/postal code/streetname to an
address node so the data is easily searchable later.<br>
<br>
I really, really have to plea to everyone to enter
_better_ data than more ...., just instead of looking at
the sheer number of address info/nodes entered. It's
quickly getting tired when I have to keep cleaning up
behind the top providers.<br>
<br>
I'll get off the soapbox now.<span><font color="#888888"><br>
<br>
Glenn<br>
</font></span></div>
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