<html>
<head>
<meta content="text/html; charset=UTF-8" http-equiv="Content-Type">
</head>
<body text="#000000" bgcolor="#FFFFFF">
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 2014-06-09 18:28, Glenn Plas pointed
out :<br>
</div>
<blockquote cite="mid:5395E0C4.7090300@byte-consult.be" type="cite"><a
moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-freetext"
href="http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:survey:date">http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:survey:date</a><br>
<a moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-freetext"
href="http://taginfo.openstreetmap.org/keys/?key=survey:date">http://taginfo.openstreetmap.org/keys/?key=survey:date</a><br>
<a
href="http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Keypad-Mapper_3#new_features_version_3.1"><b>Keypad-Mapper:
the survey date is saved with each address tag:</b></a><br>
</blockquote>
Thanks Glenn... I wasn't expecting it without a Key:survey !<br>
Curiously, <a moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-freetext"
href="http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:survey:date">Key:survey:date</a>
does not define the date format at all.<br>
Because it is mostly a Keymapper log, it's factually usually ISO,
but, one can (of course) find;<br>
<span class="overflow"><a
href="http://taginfo.openstreetmap.org/tags/?key=survey%3Adate&value=07%2F02%2F2007">07/02/2007</a></span>
February or July?<br>
<span class="overflow"><a
href="http://taginfo.openstreetmap.org/tags/?key=survey%3Adate&value=29%2F02%2F1988">29/02/1988</a>
He/She must have confused survey with another date<br>
</span><span class="overflow"></span>Furthermore, <a
moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-freetext"
href="http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:survey:date">Key:survey:date</a>
just doesn't care to say if it applies to nodes, ways, polygons
and/or relations.<br>
And it mentions a date of surveillance without saying of what.<br>
Well, more than typically OSM;-)<br>
As another comment, I find it inappropriate.<br>
<blockquote cite="mid:5395E0C4.7090300@byte-consult.be" type="cite">
<blockquote cite="mid:5395DA60.8000902@gmail.com" type="cite">At
first sight, the overpass API is able to use a regexp to look
for data but not for keys.<br>
</blockquote>
I haven't found a way to do it. You could create a union when
you know what keys to search for (but that kinda misses your point
I assume).<br>
</blockquote>
Overpass can only be used for what it can or should be improved.<br>
<br>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 2014-06-09 20:33, Marc Gemis wrote :<br>
</div>
<blockquote
cite="mid:CAJKJX-Qid8oSz0spzxJ0BeKMok4DrHSDFzfDVH+y_9LONRm+5w@mail.gmail.com"
type="cite">
<div class="moz-text-html" lang="x-unicode">
<div dir="ltr">
<div class="gmail_extra">
<div class="gmail_quote">On Mon, Jun 9, 2014 at 8:01 PM,
André Pirard <span dir="ltr"><<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:A.Pirard.Papou@gmail.com" target="_blank">A.Pirard.Papou@gmail.com</a>></span>
wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px
0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);border-left-style:solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div class="">
<blockquote type="cite">
<div dir="ltr">
<div>
What if the previous mapper doesn't survey the
same things I map ? What's the use of the survey
date in that case?</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
That is the point I raised that unlike source=...
survey:date applies to all aspect of a map element.</blockquote>
</div>
<br>
<br>
</div>
<div class="gmail_extra">what is "all" aspect ? Let's take a
highway</div>
<div class="gmail_extra"><br>
</div>
<div class="gmail_extra">
- name</div>
<div class="gmail_extra">- classification</div>
<div class="gmail_extra">- surface</div>
<div class="gmail_extra">- lanes</div>
<div class="gmail_extra">- parking lanes</div>
<div class="gmail_extra">- bicycle lanes/tracks</div>
<div class="gmail_extra">- sidewalks</div>
<div class="gmail_extra">- max weight, height, etc.</div>
<div class="gmail_extra">- is overtaking allowed</div>
<div class="gmail_extra">- crossings</div>
<div class="gmail_extra">
- others ?</div>
<div class="gmail_extra"><br>
</div>
<div class="gmail_extra">Since almost none of the streets in
Belgium are surveyed for all this information, I still have
to survey the street as it was never surveyed before. When I
started mapping I forgot to survey certain things as I was
not aware that it could be mapped. Assuming I would have put
a date on it, I would still have to resurvey.</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
That is why (not surveying "all information") survey:date is
inappropriate in addition to being ill defined.<br>
<blockquote
cite="mid:CAJKJX-Qid8oSz0spzxJ0BeKMok4DrHSDFzfDVH+y_9LONRm+5w@mail.gmail.com"
type="cite">
<div class="moz-text-html" lang="x-unicode">
<div dir="ltr">
<div class="gmail_extra">It would also mean that you have to
update the survey date on each item, even if you don't
change anything on the element (as you most likely know).
But this does not work when you put the survey date on the
changeset, as resurveyed, unchanged elements would not be
marked with this "survey date".</div>
<div class="gmail_extra"><br>
</div>
<div class="gmail_extra">Putting a survey date on each element
will have a huge impact on how people map. So they have to
touch all objects they saw during their survey, just to
indicate that they are still there (also stuff like
housenumbers, i.e. things that do not change often or not at
all).</div>
<div class="gmail_extra"><br>
</div>
<div class="gmail_extra">Wonder who's willing to do that.</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<b><i>survey</i></b> cannot do wonders, it mainly supplements an
important shortcoming of <i><b>source</b></i>.<br>
For example, it is better when the source is <i><b>visual</b></i>
to know when the feature has been visualized, or when a source
publication date is given to know that there is no more recent one.<br>
source=survey date is indeed covering a lot but is sensible for a
plain road, a house, a bus stop, as long as we restrict ourselves to
the essential (required) tags and not fancy adorning.<br>
Else, no wonders, but it's certainly not a last edit date that will
do better and I just can't figure how overpass can be imagined to
search that data.<br>
<br>
In fact, my proposed wiki update is nothing really new but a more
precise definition of what already existed and a welcomed use of the
ISO date.<br>
<blockquote
cite="mid:CAJKJX-Qid8oSz0spzxJ0BeKMok4DrHSDFzfDVH+y_9LONRm+5w@mail.gmail.com"
type="cite">
<div class="moz-text-html" lang="x-unicode">
<div dir="ltr">
<div class="gmail_extra">I've seen a discussion a long time
ago where someone asked whether it is possible to mark an
are as "done". But is an area ever done ? E.g. someone
recently proposed to map street_cabinets. So all complete
area would suddenly become incomplete, because you can map
this new thing.</div>
<div class="gmail_extra"><br>
</div>
<div class="gmail_extra">Isn't a map like <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://www.itoworld.com/map/127?lon=4.44997&lat=51.08258&zoom=13">http://www.itoworld.com/map/127?lon=4.44997&lat=51.08258&zoom=13</a>
not enough ? It's generated automatically and show where the
most recent edits were done.</div>
<div class="gmail_extra">This wouldn't require additional
effort from the mappers and is probably a good enough
approximation, not ?</div>
<div class="gmail_extra"><br>
</div>
<div class="gmail_extra">regards</div>
<div class="gmail_extra">
<br>
</div>
<div class="gmail_extra">m</div>
<br>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<br>
</body>
</html>