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    <p>+1 for the "end user's perspective".</p>
    <p>From my point of view, two key rules make the ground for OSM as
      pointed out in several places of the documentation:</p>
    <p>1. Think to end users<br>
    </p>
    <p>2. Map what really exists</p>
    <p>"Map what really exists" is visible in many places in the docs,
      and this is indeed important, up to some "threshold".<br>
      "Think to the end users" is much less visible, but is visible
      anyway.</p>
    <p>I'm afraid that, being driven mostly by technical
      profiles/mappers, the "Map what exists" rule seems to take the
      precedence because it is more visible.</p>
    <p>According to me, "Think to the end users" should be the first
      rule, in terms of priorities.<br>
      Followed by "Map what really exists", at the very same priority as
      "Use your common sense" which is also very visible in the docs...</p>
    <p>=> My 2 cents.<br>
    </p>
    <p><br>
    </p>
    <p><br>
    </p>
    <div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 13/10/20 09:37, Matthieu Gaillet
      wrote:<br>
    </div>
    <blockquote type="cite"
      cite="mid:665B2196-E032-473A-939E-CFC89316860B@gaillet.be">
      <meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=UTF-8">
      <div class="">At first I was going to agree with Tim and s8evq but
        hey, the world is changing and from an user perspective, having
        itineraries on the map is a plus, wether they are signposted or
        not. I personally never follow sign posts, I just follow ‘a'
        route on my OSM-sourced GPS.</div>
      <div class=""><br class="">
      </div>
      <div class="">Regarding the question "what should be mapped or
        not", I believe the itineraries should appear in OSM only if
        their are proposed or designed by an official operator, not mr
        nobody. That’s enough to keep quality, not staying aside nice
        initiatives (even if virtual), and stay close to exhaustive when
        it comes to official itineraries.</div>
      <div class=""><br class="">
      </div>
      <div class="">After all, a route, sign posted or not, is in a
        sense always virtual.</div>
      <div class=""><br class="">
      </div>
      <div class="">Matthieu</div>
      <div class=""><br class="">
      </div>
      <div class="">
        <div class="">
          <div>
            <blockquote type="cite" class="">
              <div class="">On 13 Oct 2020, at 08:49, Tim Couwelier <<a
                  href="mailto:tim.couwelier@gmail.com" class=""
                  moz-do-not-send="true">tim.couwelier@gmail.com</a>>
                wrote:</div>
              <br class="Apple-interchange-newline">
              <div class="">
                <div dir="ltr" class="">I'm inclined to go by 'mapping
                  verifiable ground truth'. Which means no - don't add
                  them unless signposted along the way.<br class="">
                </div>
                <br class="">
                <div class="gmail_quote">
                  <div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">Op di 13 okt. 2020
                    om 08:45 schreef s8evq <<a
                      href="mailto:s8evqq@runbox.com" class=""
                      moz-do-not-send="true">s8evqq@runbox.com</a>>:<br
                      class="">
                  </div>
                  <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px
                    0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid
                    rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">I do not think
                    they should be in OSM, and I wouldn't mind deleting
                    them. :)<br class="">
                    <br class="">
                    First of all, they are harder to keep up to date and
                    verify.<br class="">
                    Secondly, like you said, where do you draw the line.
                    Who's routes do we add and who's not? <br class="">
                    <br class="">
                    For example, Natuurpunt and some of the local
                    tourism offices already have 'virtual' hikes, where
                    they only suggest which node numbers to combine. On
                    the ground, nothing is marked. I don't think this
                    should be in OSM.<br class="">
                    <br class="">
                    If I get this correctly, 'Randonnées en Boucle'
                    (SGR) are hikes made out of parts of existing GR
                    trails? I wouldn't add that. The possibilities are
                    just endless...<br class="">
                    <br class="">
                    On Mon, 12 Oct 2020 19:57:59 +0000 (UTC), Stijn
                    Rombauts via Talk-be <<a
                      href="mailto:talk-be@openstreetmap.org"
                      target="_blank" class="" moz-do-not-send="true">talk-be@openstreetmap.org</a>>
                    wrote:<br class="">
                    <br class="">
                    > Hi,<br class="">
                    > <br class="">
                    > There is a guideline or rule that only
                    waymarked hiking/cycle/... routes should be added to
                    OSM. Not everyone agrees and there are some
                    non-waymarked routes in OSM because nobody, not even
                    me, dares to remove them.<br class="">
                    > Anyway, that rule/guideline is getting in
                    trouble because some official routes are not
                    waymarked anymore.<br class="">
                    > Provincie Vlaams-Brabant enlarged the
                    'wandelnetwerk Getevallei', but the new nodes and
                    routes are not waymarked anymore (too expensive).
                    But there is a map, a website and an app. [1]<br
                      class="">
                    > The municipality of Profondeville has the
                    project '1000 bornes' (40 parcours pour vélos de
                    route et VTT): only gps-tracks on route-you. [2]<br
                      class="">
                    > More will probably follow (or perhaps already
                    exist).<br class="">
                    > <br class="">
                    > So, what do we do? Or where do we draw the
                    line? Because the line between what can be
                    considered as official routes or not, could (in the
                    future) become very thin. Or what do we do with the
                    'Randonnées en Boucle' (SGR)? What if
                    Natuurpunt/Natagora starts with 'virtual' walking
                    routes?<br class="">
                    > <br class="">
                    > What is your opinion?<br class="">
                    > <br class="">
                    > Regards,<br class="">
                    > <br class="">
                    > StijnRR<br class="">
                    > <br class="">
                    > P.S. The new map of 'wandelnetwerk De Merode'
                    has OSM as background layer. Thanks to everyone who
                    contributed.<br class="">
                    > <br class="">
                    > [1] <a
href="https://www.toerismevlaamsbrabant.be/pagina/werken-wandelnetwerken/"
                      rel="noreferrer" target="_blank" class=""
                      moz-do-not-send="true">https://www.toerismevlaamsbrabant.be/pagina/werken-wandelnetwerken/</a><br
                      class="">
                    > [2] <a
                      href="https://www.profondeville.be/loisirs/sport/1000bornes"
                      rel="noreferrer" target="_blank" class=""
                      moz-do-not-send="true">https://www.profondeville.be/loisirs/sport/1000bornes</a><br
                      class="">
                    > <br class="">
                    > _______________________________________________<br
                      class="">
                    > Talk-be mailing list<br class="">
                    > <a href="mailto:Talk-be@openstreetmap.org"
                      target="_blank" class="" moz-do-not-send="true">Talk-be@openstreetmap.org</a><br
                      class="">
                    > <a
                      href="https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-be"
                      rel="noreferrer" target="_blank" class=""
                      moz-do-not-send="true">https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-be</a><br
                      class="">
                    <br class="">
                    <br class="">
                    <br class="">
                    _______________________________________________<br
                      class="">
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                    <a href="mailto:Talk-be@openstreetmap.org"
                      target="_blank" class="" moz-do-not-send="true">Talk-be@openstreetmap.org</a><br
                      class="">
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                  </blockquote>
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      <pre class="moz-quote-pre" wrap="">_______________________________________________
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