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<p>Hi Joost,<br>
<br>
> I'd say it is useful to add service:bicycle:charging directly
to objects, as it makes it easy to find "bicycle friendly
objects". Having this as "yes" doesn't mean you can't add the
actual charging location as a separate node as well (similar to
how a camper site can have simultaneously both the attribute for a
dump station as well as a node). <br>
<br>
I kindoff disagree with this 'double tagging', as it is not
maintainable in the long run. To stick with campersites, should we
also tag that there is a playground, a shop, a toilet, ... on the
campersite outline? What if there is a public playground just
around the corner? IMHO it is up to the data consumer to check
which points are nearby and to figure out what a 'bicycle friendly
object' is. <br>
<br>
> I wonder if the availability of a power plug indoor is enough
to conclude you can charge your bike battery there. If I were to
ask, I'd ask "is it OK to charge my phone" or "is it OK to charge
my bike battery" - and I wouldn't assume the answer to the second
question to be yes just because the first is yes.<br>
<br>
Good point, didn't think of that. Some cafés/pubs/... have
electrical plugs exposed in their dining areas which you can just
use, I was in the first place thinking about mapping these as they
are objectively visible.<br>
<br>
> A related thought is that if there's an outdoor plug, you
could also use it to slowly slowly charge your electric car. This
only makes sense at hotels/B&Bs I guess, because I don't think
you'd get meaningful charge during a coffee break.</p>
<div dir="auto">Which is why this outdoor plug should be mapped as a
separate point, with the full support of adding socket types,
power outputs and accessibility for various vehicles.<br>
<br>
> Do we really care if people can charge their phone though?<br>
<br>
I do, and the persons who paid me to develop the theme care even
more ;)<br>
I've even seen cafés which have a stand of battery packs to charge
your phone - but that is a paid service though.<br>
<br>
> Do we really want to map the answer to a question that could
be answered by a random employee? The next one might answer
differently. I wonder if we might be better off saying : hey, if
you want to explicitly offer power plugs to customers, put a
sticker on the door or on the plug, and then we can map that. <br>
<br>
Valid point - such a sticker would indeed objectify it. <br>
<br>
> Are there any cafes that actually actively offer power plugs
indoor? If not, I'd just leave it be. The only question I'd ask
then is "Does this place offer a dedicated place to charge
bicycles?" and add service:bicycle:charging=yes to the object if
that's the case.
<div dir="auto"><br>
Yes, there are - for example coffee shops in trainstations
typically offer those for commuters who want to work a bit on
their laptop while waiting for their train. These outlets are
sometimes even integrated in the furniture and tables; in some
cases even offering an USB-outlet too.<br>
</div>
<br>
<br>
</div>
<pre class="moz-signature" cols="72">Met vriendelijke groeten,
Pieter Vander Vennet</pre>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 29.09.21 09:58, joost schouppe
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:CAO2_g7J+idPKA=wbN=AR_01d5V-X090Wnvakpgiv4h9Wy47zhw@mail.gmail.com">
<div dir="auto">
<div>Hi Pieter,
<div dir="auto"><br>
</div>
<div dir="auto">I'd say it is useful to add
service:bicycle:charging directly to objects, as it makes it
easy to find "bicycle friendly objects". Having this as
"yes" doesn't mean you can't add the actual charging
location as a separate node as well (similar to how a camper
site can have simultaneously both the attribute for a dump
station as well as a node). </div>
<div dir="auto"><br>
</div>
<div dir="auto">I wonder if the availability of a power plug
indoor is enough to conclude you can charge your bike
battery there. If I were to ask, I'd ask "is it OK to charge
my phone" or "is it OK to charge my bike battery" - and I
wouldn't assume the answer to the second question to be yes
just because the first is yes.</div>
<div dir="auto"><br>
</div>
<div dir="auto">A related thought is that if there's an
outdoor plug, you could also use it to slowly slowly charge
your electric car. This only makes sense at hotels/B&Bs
I guess, because I don't think you'd get meaningful charge
during a coffee break.</div>
<div dir="auto"><br>
</div>
<div dir="auto">Do we really care if people can charge their
phone though? Do we really want to map the answer to a
question that could be answered by a random employee? The
next one might answer differently. I wonder if we might be
better off saying : hey, if you want to explicitly offer
power plugs to customers, put a sticker on the door or on
the plug, and then we can map that. </div>
<div dir="auto"><br>
</div>
Are there any cafes that actually actively offer power plugs
indoor? If not, I'd just leave it be. The only question I'd
ask then is "Does this place offer a dedicated place to charge
bicycles?" and add service:bicycle:charging=yes to the object
if that's the case.</div>
<div dir="auto"><br>
</div>
<div dir="auto">Just my random thoughts on the subject though
:) </div>
<div dir="auto"><br>
</div>
<div dir="auto">Joost<br>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote" dir="auto">
<div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">Op di 28 sep. 2021 21:29
schreef Pieter Vander Vennet <<a
href="mailto:pietervdvn@posteo.net"
moz-do-not-send="true">pietervdvn@posteo.net</a>>:<br>
</div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote">Hi everyone,<br>
<br>
I'm trying to amend the charging-stations/restaurants
theme on <br>
mapcomplete and want to add wether a
restaurant/pub/cafe/... offers <br>
access to electricity (e.g. to take the battery of your
electrical bike <br>
inside to charge it, or to charge your phone).<br>
<br>
However, I'm a bit conflicted on which tagging to use. I'm
thinking in <br>
the direction of
`service:electricity=yes|customers|no|ask_staff`. <br>
`service:bicycle:charging` would be fitting too, however,
access to <br>
electricity is broader then just charging bicycles and I
don't think you <br>
can take you bicycle inside of most restaurants.<br>
<br>
Note that charging stations (e.g. a plug provided at the
bicycle <br>
parking) should be mapped as a separate point with <br>
`amenity=charging_station` (eventually with
`access=customers`).<br>
<br>
Anyone have an opinion on this?<br>
<br>
-- <br>
Met vriendelijke groeten,<br>
Pieter Vander Vennet<br>
<br>
<br>
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