<div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif;font-size:small">I think at this point in time we need to try to get some sort of agreement on how to proceed. My first thought would be to ban the youngsters so anyone under 65 shouldn't be involved. That way it would slow the process down unfortunately it isn't really practical.</div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif;font-size:small"><br></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif;font-size:small">I think we need time to digest and review what has been done so far. I think it would be sensible for a different mapper to go over the imported areas using the task manager and verify the buildings against Bing or other imagery to ensure we haven't introduced an imaginary town etc.</div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif;font-size:small"><br></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif;font-size:small">I do think we need to break the import up into more manageable chunks. Whether these need to be at municipal level or not needs thought. The case for is that would allow the data from different sources to be carefully checked over. The case against is there are a lot of municipalities and in places like Manitoba there are very few mappers on the ground.<br></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif;font-size:small"><br></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif;font-size:small">Basically from a population point of view Canada is a collection of around half a dozen cities and these have a local OSM community. Montreal, Ottawa, Vancouver, Toronto for example. Once you take these out then you have much smaller numbers. I'm not certain about Calgary and Edmonton whether they have a local community or not.</div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif;font-size:small"><br></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif;font-size:small">Quebec with its own mailing list is self contained and I think will sort itself out in time. Montreal is working together to sort something out.</div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif;font-size:small"><br></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif;font-size:small">Terraced houses in Ottawa we just have the outline with a tag of terrace. This was the way they were mapped even before the City of Ottawa import. Units may have an individual address node.</div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif;font-size:small"><br></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif;font-size:small">At the moment I favour breaking the country up into provinces and for each province depending on the number of buildings I might split it up again. So Ontario would be something like Ontario rural and Toronto but I'm not quite sure of where Toronto begins and ends. <br></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif;font-size:small"><br></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif;font-size:small">Thoughts and bear in mind that Microsoft has released buildings for Canada as well. I haven't noticed an import plan but it would be fairly easy for someone to bring in some buildings so to retain some sort of control a plan might well be useful.</div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif;font-size:small"><br></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif;font-size:small">Thanks John</div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif;font-size:small"><br></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif;font-size:small"><br></div></div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Fri, 15 Mar 2019 at 15:34, Tim Elrick <<a href="mailto:osm@elrick.de" target="_blank">osm@elrick.de</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<div bgcolor="#FFFFFF">
<div class="gmail-m_5005880958784194241gmail-m_6051765985808041924gmail-m_4666347900502471575moz-cite-prefix">I think, Montreal's OSMappers would
appreciate to discuss the import of the buildings there first on
the local list. By the way, John, I have never said I would be
taking the lead for the entirety of Québec (at least, at the
moment). However, I feel that the import should be discussed on
the liste OSM de Québec first.<br>
</div>
<div class="gmail-m_5005880958784194241gmail-m_6051765985808041924gmail-m_4666347900502471575moz-cite-prefix"><br>
</div>
<div class="gmail-m_5005880958784194241gmail-m_6051765985808041924gmail-m_4666347900502471575moz-cite-prefix">Danny, I disagree with you on the
import of building blocks. I find it much more tedious to discern
them later, then splitting them into single buildings first before
importing, because, I think, you need to know your neighbourhood
very well to find unsplit buildings in the OSM database. Doing
this for a whole town or even city (like Montreal) would take much
longer than pre-processing.</div>
<div class="gmail-m_5005880958784194241gmail-m_6051765985808041924gmail-m_4666347900502471575moz-cite-prefix"><br>
</div>
<div class="gmail-m_5005880958784194241gmail-m_6051765985808041924gmail-m_4666347900502471575moz-cite-prefix">As for the rest, I have some
understanding for the impatience of OSMappers about the moratorium
on the import - as quite some time has passed and the discussion
hasn't really moved on nor has the development of the countrywide
import plan [1] - last change there was beginning of February. <br>
</div>
<div class="gmail-m_5005880958784194241gmail-m_6051765985808041924gmail-m_4666347900502471575moz-cite-prefix"><br>
</div>
<div class="gmail-m_5005880958784194241gmail-m_6051765985808041924gmail-m_4666347900502471575moz-cite-prefix">Having looked at the Microsoft data and
compared quality to the Open Building Database in two places
(Montréal, QC and Williams Lake, BC), I would suggest to refrain
from using it as a source for importing, unless you verify them
for small areas (but then you can almost draw them by hand). In
dense areas like downtown Montréal the building footprints are in
many cases plainly wrong (see my contribution to this list on
2019-03-02, 19h57 EST), in more scattered areas and suburban
landscapes buildings are randomly aligned and quite some buildings
are missing (my unverified estimate is about 5-10%).<br>
</div>
<div class="gmail-m_5005880958784194241gmail-m_6051765985808041924gmail-m_4666347900502471575moz-cite-prefix"><br>
</div>
<div class="gmail-m_5005880958784194241gmail-m_6051765985808041924gmail-m_4666347900502471575moz-cite-prefix">As for the Open Building database, it
is important to discern the data by the sources as each
municipality that contributed data might have used different
methods and has different mapping standards. Now add the
disagreement on this list about orthogonalization and building
details. I think, this suggests breaking up the import plan in
smaller batches; for the start it can be cloned from the original
one, but the pre-processing and import process might differ due to
how data sources might need to be treated as well as how local OSM
communities would like to go forward. <br>
</div>
<div class="gmail-m_5005880958784194241gmail-m_6051765985808041924gmail-m_4666347900502471575moz-cite-prefix"><br>
</div>
<div class="gmail-m_5005880958784194241gmail-m_6051765985808041924gmail-m_4666347900502471575moz-cite-prefix">What do you reckon?</div>
<div class="gmail-m_5005880958784194241gmail-m_6051765985808041924gmail-m_4666347900502471575moz-cite-prefix"><br>
</div>
<div class="gmail-m_5005880958784194241gmail-m_6051765985808041924gmail-m_4666347900502471575moz-cite-prefix">Tim<br>
</div>
<div class="gmail-m_5005880958784194241gmail-m_6051765985808041924gmail-m_4666347900502471575moz-cite-prefix"><br>
</div>
<div class="gmail-m_5005880958784194241gmail-m_6051765985808041924gmail-m_4666347900502471575moz-cite-prefix">[1]
<a class="gmail-m_5005880958784194241gmail-m_6051765985808041924gmail-m_4666347900502471575moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Canada_Building_Import" target="_blank">https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Canada_Building_Import</a><br>
</div>
<div class="gmail-m_5005880958784194241gmail-m_6051765985808041924gmail-m_4666347900502471575moz-cite-prefix"><br>
</div>
<div class="gmail-m_5005880958784194241gmail-m_6051765985808041924gmail-m_4666347900502471575moz-cite-prefix"><br>
</div>
<div class="gmail-m_5005880958784194241gmail-m_6051765985808041924gmail-m_4666347900502471575moz-cite-prefix">On 2019-03-15 14:01, John Whelan wrote:<br>
</div>
<div class="gmail-m_5005880958784194241gmail-m_6051765985808041924gmail-m_4666347900502471575replaced-blockquote" type="cite">
<div style="font-size:12pt;font-family:Verdana">Which I think
comes back to defining the local mappers.<br>
<br>
There has been discussion on Montreal as well and not all
Ontario thinks the same way. Ottawa local mappers for example
have different opinions to Pierre and Nate on what is acceptable
and I'm under the impression that not everyone in Toronto agrees
with Nate's position.<br>
<br>
We seem to be blocking out parts of the country such as Montreal
is this a reasonable approach?<br>
<br>
Can we find someway to loosely define local groups and their
areas of responsibility and how to contact them?<br>
<br>
For example one small Ontario city has to my knowledge one
OpenStreetMap mapper who maps very occasionally. My
understanding is they would be quite happy to see an import
happen but many of the buildings have already been mapped
although not to the accuracy that the Stats Can data offers.
How do you deal with these smaller cities and townships?<br>
<br>
Thanks<br>
<br>
Cheerio John<br>
<br>
<span>Paul Norman via Talk-ca wrote on 2019-03-15 1:45 PM:</span><br>
<blockquote type="cite">On
2019-03-15 9:07 a.m., Andrew Lester wrote:
<br>
<blockquote type="cite">I disagree. Silence won't solve
anything.
<br>
<br>
I'm speaking here as a local BC mapper, and I strongly disa
gree with these recent imports.
<br>
</blockquote>
<br>
I'm also a BC mapper, and have only seen the consultation
happen over Ontario, not BC.
<br>
<br>
<br>
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