<div dir="auto">I would support Jarek's views here if that helps you see a consensus.<div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">I have yet to come across an unpaved motorway in Canada. We are reasonably civilised in the North.</div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">We do have ice roads but they really aren't motorways.</div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">Cheerio John</div></div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Fri, Jan 27, 2023, 14:49 David Salmon <<a href="mailto:David.Salmon@tomtom.com">David.Salmon@tomtom.com</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
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<p class="MsoNormal">Hi Jarek,<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">It could be difficult for some users to distinguish between specific surface types using only aerial imagery alone. Even if there’s ground truth data, like Bing Streetside or Mapillary, depending on the lighting conditions and image clarity,
interpretation could be tricky. Flagging a task as Too Hard is an option to cover situations where the user can’t confidently make a determination with the available source material.<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">However, I don’t sense a consensus yet on the approach of using Paved versus a specific surface value. Would you prefer that I make the challenge Not Discoverable until there’s time to conclude the discussion?<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Generally the types of leads that TomTom can generate for potential updates to OSM are usually incidental but spread across wide areas. With that in mind, MapRoulette tends to be a better fit. Although we have used HOT Tasking manager at
the request of communities too. We’re open to tailoring the approach depending on the need.<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">I’m interested in learning more about the history of the fords and waterways topic to understand how we can help. Let me know if you’d be interested in joining an online meeting to discuss that topic further.<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">All the best,<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">David<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> Jarek Piórkowski <<a href="mailto:jarek@piorkowski.ca" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">jarek@piorkowski.ca</a>> <br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, January 26, 2023 3:11 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> <a href="mailto:talk-ca@openstreetmap.org" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">talk-ca@openstreetmap.org</a>; David Salmon <<a href="mailto:David.Salmon@tomtom.com" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">David.Salmon@tomtom.com</a>><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Talk-ca] New MapRoulette Challenge - Add Surface to Highways<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
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<span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Segoe UI",sans-serif;color:#212121">You don't often get email from
<a href="mailto:jarek@piorkowski.ca" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">jarek@piorkowski.ca</a>. <a href="https://aka.ms/LearnAboutSenderIdentification" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">
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<p class="MsoNormal">Hello David,<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Welcome to the list, and thank you for the introduction.<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">The task description on MapRoulette says "The goal of this challenge is to identify and add missing surface tags on motorways and motorway links as they represent high speed roads, and it is desirable to accurately tag the surface for these
highways."<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">In this specific case, it might be easier to assume in map and router applications that all motorways in Canada are paved unless tagged otherwise. I am not aware of any exceptions, and if some exist, they are probably already tagged as
unpaved. I'm seeing an analogy to defaulting to oneway=yes on motorways and only tagging the ways that are oneway=no.<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">If you are looking for more detail than "paved", can all MapRoulette challenge participants reliably distinguish between asphalt, concrete, and other types of pavement using aerial imagery?<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Are you planning on expanding this challenge to other roads, and will those be also done using aerial imagery?<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">I am a little skeptical about using MapRoulette to obtain precise data like this. I have seen fords wrongly added in southern Ontario by MapRoulette users seemingly more eager to solve the task quickly than to improve the map. These users
displayed little familiarity about how roads in the region actually look: crossings of streams are overwhelmingly culverts, and many streams are anyway inaccurate from an old import, but cleanup takes time, so instead they put on the ford tag and moved on.
I don't think that kind of challenge really helps the map. But maybe we can set up a MapRoulette challenge to correct ford crossings on roads in southern Ontario that are actually culverts.<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Curious to hear your thoughts on data quality and how MapRoulette-sourced surface information helps OSM and TomTom.<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Thanks,<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Jarek<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">On Wed, Jan 25, 2023, at 08:03, David Salmon wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="m_-2299408951094346923qt-msonormal1"><span lang="EN">Hello Canada OSM Community,</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="m_-2299408951094346923qt-msonormal1"><span lang="EN"> </span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="m_-2299408951094346923qt-msonormal1"><span lang="EN">I hope that the beginning of 2023 is going well for everyone.</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="m_-2299408951094346923qt-msonormal1"><span lang="EN"> </span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="m_-2299408951094346923qt-msonormal1"><span lang="EN">I’d like to introduce myself - my name is David, and I have picked-up the role of TomTom Community Manager for the United States and Canada from
<a href="https://eur02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.openstreetmap.org%2Fuser%2Fcourtiney%2F&data=05%7C01%7Cdavid.salmon%40tomtom.com%7C80e35a13fd2c40e00d9f08daffd986e2%7C374f80267b544a3ab87d328fa26ec10d%7C0%7C0%7C638103606990259675%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=bfegGrEUTC%2FMuwIQFzv86Vb5DzXZDwsJegGGuIjbAKY%3D&reserved=0" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">
<span style="color:#0563c1">Courtney</span></a>.</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="m_-2299408951094346923qt-msonormal1"><span lang="EN"> </span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="m_-2299408951094346923qt-msonormal1"><span lang="EN">I’m reaching out to inform you that we have created a new MapRoulette challenge in order to add Surface to ways in Ontario. To detect the issues in this challenge, we used Overpass Turbo to select Motorways where the
Surface tag was not present.</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="m_-2299408951094346923qt-msonormal1"><span lang="EN"> </span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="m_-2299408951094346923qt-msonormal1"><span lang="EN">You can find the challenge here: </span>
<a href="https://eur02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fmaproulette.org%2Fbrowse%2Fchallenges%2F37420&data=05%7C01%7Cdavid.salmon%40tomtom.com%7C80e35a13fd2c40e00d9f08daffd986e2%7C374f80267b544a3ab87d328fa26ec10d%7C0%7C0%7C638103606990259675%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=97UselFc%2FJIFlRcltF7s2%2BcDNGNJQWq%2Bn3zcCU1z%2FOM%3D&reserved=0" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer"><span style="color:#0563c1">Canada
- Add Surface to Highway - January 2023 - Ontario</span></a><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="m_-2299408951094346923qt-msonormal1"><span lang="EN"> </span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="m_-2299408951094346923qt-msonormal1"><span lang="EN">In the description of the challenge you can find some additional information that will make it easier for you to solve the tasks.</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="m_-2299408951094346923qt-msonormal1"><span lang="EN"> </span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="m_-2299408951094346923qt-msonormal1"><span lang="EN">Do not hesitate to contact me at <a href="mailto:david.salmon@tomtom.com" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">
<span style="color:#0563c1">david.salmon@tomtom.com</span></a> to talk about possible collaborations, problems or challenges that you have detected. If you want to share them with us, we will be happy to explore how we can help.</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="m_-2299408951094346923qt-msonormal1"><span lang="EN"> </span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="m_-2299408951094346923qt-msonormal1"><span lang="EN">In the meantime, happy editing!</span><u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">_______________________________________________<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Talk-ca mailing list<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><a href="mailto:Talk-ca@openstreetmap.org" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer"><span style="color:#0563c1">Talk-ca@openstreetmap.org</span></a><u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><a href="https://eur02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Flists.openstreetmap.org%2Flistinfo%2Ftalk-ca&data=05%7C01%7Cdavid.salmon%40tomtom.com%7C80e35a13fd2c40e00d9f08daffd986e2%7C374f80267b544a3ab87d328fa26ec10d%7C0%7C0%7C638103606990259675%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=fXVztbGq%2F49jOMGZ8b%2Fi6WUpCvKvyIu6TrxeIkQ1y8o%3D&reserved=0" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer"><span style="color:#0563c1">https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-ca</span></a><u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
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_______________________________________________<br>
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