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<div class="moz-cite-prefix">Am 09.01.2022 um 12:54 schrieb
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:tonyosm9@gmail.com">tonyosm9@gmail.com</a>:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:693d56c5-3cc8-3fa9-bc75-06f569ebb715@gmail.com">As we
seem to be agreed not to use place but substreet or parent street
can I put my tuppence in to support substreet.
<br>
My logic is that addresses in GB are read from lowest to highest -
4, Rose Terrace, Garden Street, Myvillage, Mycity. Using the word
parentstreet suggests to me it is superior to street and would
appear after street in the hierarchy of street, conversely
substreet is lower in the hierarchy and therefore closer to the
top part of the address. So I prefer Sarah's version
addr:housenumber=4
<br>
addr:substreet=Rose Terrace
<br>
addr:street=Garden Street
<br>
</blockquote>
<p>There is no hierarchical nor visual difference between that and</p>
<i>addr:street=Rose Terrace</i><i><br>
</i><i>addr:parentstreet=Garden Street</i>
<p>But this variant allows addr:street (and addr:place) to work just
as for addresses that don't require an additional level of
hierarchy, and avoids confusion with addresses that actually
require an addr:street=Garden Street <br>
</p>
<p>Simon<br>
</p>
<p><br>
</p>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:693d56c5-3cc8-3fa9-bc75-06f569ebb715@gmail.com">
<br>
As usual in GB there will be lots of edge cases which will not fit
whatever we decide - companies and people have made things up as
there has been no official government addressing schema, and some
addresses are streets away from their company applied address -
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/215406779#map=16/53.7052/-2.6456&layers=TN">https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/215406779#map=16/53.7052/-2.6456&layers=TN</a>
(which is also factually wrong)
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://storelocator.asda.com/north-west/chorley/clayton-green-centre-sheephill-lane">https://storelocator.asda.com/north-west/chorley/clayton-green-centre-sheephill-lane</a><br>
<br>
Aside - there is also the descriptive style of addressing -
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-59900687?at_medium=RSS&at_campaign=KARANGA">https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-59900687?at_medium=RSS&at_campaign=KARANGA</a><br>
<br>
Tony Shield - TonyS999
<br>
<br>
On 09/01/2022 10:49, Sarah Hoffmann via Talk-GB
<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:talk-gb@openstreetmap.org"><talk-gb@openstreetmap.org></a> wrote:
<br>
<blockquote type="cite">Hi,
<br>
<br>
Rob has asked me to comment on the current state of the
discussion from
<br>
my point of view as Nominatim developer. Following his lead, I
won't
<br>
answer anybody in particular but just summarize my views.
<br>
<br>
I do have been following the discussion closely. It all looks
quite
<br>
reasonable so that there was no need to add to the noise.
<br>
Thank you for taking the time to start a wiki page.
<br>
<br>
The most pressing point from my side was the (ab)use of the
addr:street
<br>
tag that are not streets. I think that point has been understood
and
<br>
is well addressed in all suggestions. As Tom notes, Nominatim
does do a
<br>
match-up with the street object. This is not just a technical
<br>
optimisation. The street object can deliver useful additional
<br>
information, for example name translation in bilingual places
like
<br>
Brussels. That's why Nominatim is rather unforgiving when there
is no
<br>
street with the same name as in addr:street. (If you want to
find issues
<br>
on that side, the QA view 'addr:street wrong name'
<br>
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://nominatim.org/qa/#map=7.57/53.49/-1.00&layer=addr_street_wrong_name">https://nominatim.org/qa/#map=7.57/53.49/-1.00&layer=addr_street_wrong_name</a>
<br>
shows where Nominatim disagrees on your choice of addr:street.)
<br>
<br>
Regarding the opposing proposals of addr:substreet (as currently
in the
<br>
wiki) and addr:parentstreet (as proposed by Simon Poole and Tom
<br>
Crocker), they work both from a data user point of view as far
as I can
<br>
see. Which one you go for depends on whether you put more
emphasis on
<br>
the dependent street or the parent street in an address:
<br>
<br>
Say you have an address like '4 Rose Terrace, Garden Street'.
You can
<br>
tag this as:
<br>
<br>
addr:housenumber=4
<br>
addr:substreet=Rose Terrace
<br>
addr:street=Garden Street
<br>
<br>
A data user who does not know about the UK system would output
an
<br>
address of '4 Garden Street'.
<br>
<br>
Or you could tag the address as:
<br>
<br>
addr:housenumber=4
<br>
addr:place=Rose Terrace
<br>
addr:parentstreet=Garden Street
<br>
<br>
which our unsuspecting data user would read as '4 Rose Terrace'.
<br>
<br>
Which one is less wrong? Initially I thought the first version
would be
<br>
better because it brings you at least in the vicinity of the
right
<br>
address. In the meantime I have learnt that there may well be an
<br>
actual address '4 Garden Street'. So I see the potential for
confusion.
<br>
<br>
I also had some reservations about using addr:place for
something like a
<br>
building or a terrace. When it was invented, they idea was that
it
<br>
refers to some place= node (hence addr:place), i.e. something
that is
<br>
conceptually above street level. However, thinking more about
it, this
<br>
is just a historical detail and not that relevant. The important
<br>
function of addr:place is to mark a non-street address. If the
place is
<br>
above or below street-level address-wise is an implementation
detail
<br>
that can be covered with addr:parentstreet.
<br>
<br>
You'll know British addresses better than me, so you'll decide
if you
<br>
prefer addr:substreet or addr:parentstreet. Data users will
thank you
<br>
if you go for one or the other, not both. And don't forget to
add it
<br>
to the main addr:* page in the wiki when you have decided. There
might
<br>
be other places after all with a similar concept that might want
to
<br>
reuse the tags.
<br>
<br>
A quick word on the other address tags: Nominatim doesn't really
care
<br>
what exactly you use there. It will use them pretty much all for
search.
<br>
My advice would be to a) always use addr:city for the postal
town (i.e.
<br>
the name you put next to the postcode in the address) and b)
only add
<br>
names that would show up in the address. If 'address' then
refers to the
<br>
official RM address or the address used by any sane human being
<br>
(or both) doesn't really matter. Just remember that if you don't
put one
<br>
or the other into the address tags and it doesn't correspond to
the
<br>
geographical location either, then the address won't be found.
(SK53's
<br>
example in Scotland was a perfect example of a RM address that
is
<br>
unsearchable unless added to the addr:* tags.)
<br>
<br>
Sarah
<br>
<br>
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<br>
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<br>
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<br>
<br>
</blockquote>
<br>
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<br>
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<br>
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<br>
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<br>
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