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<p>Hi</p>
<p>Moving into the discussion space of the address levels above?
street.</p>
<p>Suburb works for many locales, but what about towns, parishes and
villages and hamlets?</p>
<p>I can best illustrate by my practice where live in Chorley,
Lancashire - a Borough Council area<br>
</p>
<p>Chorley is a postal town, but that fits well with addr:city,</p>
<p>There are 23 civil parishes most centred around a village - so
addr:village for most of them; but several of the Western parishes
have Leyland as their postal town - does not cause too much
confusion as the villages are prominent enough.</p>
<p>Withnell Parish is large and has three villages and one hamlet -
each with a strong Identity - so addr:village and addr:hamlet work
well.<br>
</p>
<p>Chorley Town is unparished, but has several areas which are
regarded as suburbs - so addr:suburb works well.</p>
<p>A major oddity is Buckshaw Village - a new housing estate from
the old Ordnance Factory (a very large factory 376 Ha) - which has
elements in Chorley Town, Whittle-le-Woods Parish, Euxton Parish
and South Ribble council. It straddles the Leyland and Chorley
post towns. I tend to use add:village=Buckshaw Village - local
custom - and the correct postal town, but some areas are marked
by Royal Mail as Euxton, others as Buckshaw Village even though
they are in Whittle-le-Woods - No Consistency. <br>
</p>
<p>The result of this usage is that local identity is preserved, it
(mostly) conforms with local government administrative
organisation and most importantly provides a followable address
which is human readable and will take a person closer to the
location by reading a printed OSM.</p>
<p>It follows that changing addr:place to addr:suburb can often be
wrong - I know I have used place incorrectly for villages and
hamlets ( I am correcting these).</p>
<p>Unparished areas may require different ideas and suburb may
appropriate - but I think the local rules for each area need to be
defined. I see that Chorley has an OSM wiki page - so if there is
agreement I shall write the above in there.<br>
</p>
<p>Tony<br>
</p>
<p><br>
</p>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 13/01/2022 23:51, Rob Nickerson
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:CAK4yQTmXo81DvpdpLyL4_aOCPCpPJmsY2hLFN7vujP=ep9bXNQ@mail.gmail.com">
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<div>Hi all,</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>As we learnt the other week, the addr:place tag has often
been incorrectly used here in the UK. The tag addr:place is
meant to be used when the address does <u>not</u> reference
a street (tagged with addr:street) at all. This is
frequently seen in small villages in continental Europe
which often don't have any street names at all.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>In the UK most cases of addr:place and addr:street being
used together are incorrect and are cases where addr:suburb
should have been used instead of addr:place. You can browse
the <a rel="nofollow" class="external gmail-text"
href="https://nominatim.org/qa/#map=8.06/53.26/-0.64&layer=addr_place_and_street"
moz-do-not-send="true">Nominatim QA</a> to find examples
and help clean these up. </div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>To help with this clean up effort I have tested an
approach in JOSM that some might consider as captured by the
Automated Edits code of conduct. I therefore wanted to share
this process before proceeding.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Step 1:</div>
<div>Identify a potentially incorrect use of the addr:place
tag. To do this I am looking at the list of values used on
TagInfo GB and checking if any of these are villages/towns.
If they are then there is a high chance that the addr:place
tag is incorrect.</div>
<div><a
href="https://taginfo.openstreetmap.org.uk/keys/addr%3Aplace#values"
moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-freetext">https://taginfo.openstreetmap.org.uk/keys/addr%3Aplace#values</a></div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Step 2:</div>
<div>Open the data in JOSM using an overpass query. An example
query I am using to download the data is:</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>[out:xml][timeout:90];<br>
{{geocodeArea:England}}->.searchArea;<br>
(<br>
nwr["addr:place"="Eccleston"](area.searchArea);<br>
);<br>
(._;>;);<br>
out meta;</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Step 3:</div>
<div>Inspect the data in JOSM paying particular attention to
other addr:* tags. To do this I start by doing a Ctrl+F and
search for e.g. "addr:place"="Eccleston". This selects all
the features with this tag. I can then see the full range of
addr:* tags used on these features. High use of addr:street
reiterates the incorrect use of addr:place. I can also see
if the addr:suburb tag has been used on any features ->
if it has then I go investigate this separately. I also
investigate uses of all other addr tags except
housenumber/name, unit, flats and street.<br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Step 4<br>
</div>
<div>Change addr:place to add:suburb. I get to this stage
quicker if step 3 does not identify any conflicting addr:*
tags (e.g. if the only other addr tags are housenumber/name
and street). The more addr:* tags there are the more I look
into individual OSM features before making this change.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>As always, if in doubt then I don't proceed.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>How do you feel about this sort of approach? With proper
time spent carefully looking at the other addr tags that
have been used, then I believe it is a low risk edit.<br>
</div>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>P.S. Feel free to check out the results of a couple trials
I made. e.g. <a
href="https://www.openstreetmap.org/changeset/116122672#map=14/53.6500/-2.7281"
moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-freetext">https://www.openstreetmap.org/changeset/116122672#map=14/53.6500/-2.7281</a>
I'll pause on making more as I realise I should get the
discussion going first.<br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Thank you,<br>
</div>
<div>
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data-smartmail="gmail_signature">
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<div>
<div dir="ltr"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,255)"><b>Rob</b></span><br>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<br>
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