<html><body><div style="color:#000; background-color:#fff; font-family:times new roman, new york, times, serif;font-size:12pt"><div><span>Yes, I think it may be more productive in this case to approach the leaders of the OSM Japan community, rather than individual mappers.</span></div><div> </div><div>* Mikel Maron * +14152835207 @mikel s:mikelmaron<br><blockquote style="border-left: 2px solid rgb(16, 16, 255); margin-left: 5px; margin-top: 5px; padding-left: 5px;"> <div style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'times new roman', 'new york', times, serif; "> <div style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'times new roman', 'new york', times, serif; "> <div dir="ltr"> <font size="2" face="Arial"> <hr size="1"> <b><span style="font-weight:bold;">From:</span></b> Andrew Errington <erringtona@gmail.com><br> <b><span style="font-weight: bold;">To:</span></b> Mikel Maron <mikel_maron@yahoo.com>; talk-ko@openstreetmap.org; Wesley Woo-Duk
Hwang-Chung <wesley96@gmail.com> <br> <b><span style="font-weight: bold;">Sent:</span></b> Thursday, August 23, 2012 9:37 AM<br> <b><span style="font-weight: bold;">Subject:</span></b> Re: [Talk-ko] Possible border dispute brewing?<br> </font> </div> <br>
Hi,<br><br>I asked someone for advice about this and indeed was told to try approaching <br>the mappers directly.<br><br>I did ask a couple of mappers to stop, but it was a couple of months ago and I <br>never received a reply. Since then I have looked at the area again and seen <br>more damage. It is frustrating to me as I care a lot about the map.<br><br>I am not going to choose sides, but I think that since Dokdo is currently <br>protected by Korea it should be labelled as Korean territory. If this <br>changes in the future then of course it can be re-labelled. Naturally, <br>tagging can include :ko and :ja tags simultaneously.<br><br>I have not attempted to contact any Japanese group. Has anyone else?<br><br>Finally, just FYI there are 34 addresses on this mailing list (a couple of <br>which are 'bots) and it's usually quiet. I don't know if this represents <br>all, most, some or a few of the mappers in
Korea. Also, Korean mappers speak <br>Korean, so we need a volunteer translator (or several) to translate anything <br>important between Korean and English.<br><br>Best wishes,<br><br>Andrew<br><br>On Thu, 23 Aug 2012 22:30:56 Mikel Maron wrote:<br>> Hi<br>><br>> I was asked by the poster of this thread to act in mediation on this issue.<br>> I am happy to do so.<br>><br>> The same issue has been raised to me multiple times after I visited South<br>> Korea in May (when I joined this list). Each time I have said the same<br>> thing initially, and received no further response. The first step for<br>> dispute mediation in OSM is for those affected to attempt dialogue directly<br>> with the other mappers involved; and failing that, the other community<br>> involved, if it exists and is<br>> active. http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Disputes<br>><br>> Has this been tried by anyone? The Japanese OSM
community has a mailing<br>> list, and the main members are the same that are organizing this year's<br>> SOTM. In short, I would expect a reasonable and open response to<br>> communication.<br>><br>> Thanks<br>> Mikel<br>><br>> <br>><br>> * Mikel Maron * +14152835207 @mikel s:mikelmaron<br>><br>> >________________________________<br>> > From: Wesley Woo-Duk Hwang-Chung <<a ymailto="mailto:wesley96@gmail.com" href="mailto:wesley96@gmail.com">wesley96@gmail.com</a>><br>> >To: "<a ymailto="mailto:Talk-ko@openstreetmap.org" href="mailto:Talk-ko@openstreetmap.org">Talk-ko@openstreetmap.org</a>" <<a ymailto="mailto:Talk-ko@openstreetmap.org" href="mailto:Talk-ko@openstreetmap.org">Talk-ko@openstreetmap.org</a>><br>> >Sent: Thursday, August 23, 2012 8:07 AM<br>> >Subject: [Talk-ko] Possible border dispute brewing?<br>> ><br>> ><br>> >While I was editing the
administrative border for<br>> > Gyeongsangbuk-do(Gyeongbuk), it came to my attention that a user named<br>> > kazuchi has removed Dokdo's maritime border. This was noticeable since<br>> > Dokdo is part of Gyeongbuk.<br>> ><br>> >My suspicion is that the user in question is a Japanese. In any case,<br>> > while I was doing further edits to complete the admin borders for<br>> > Gyeongbuk, the editor spewed out save errors. Seeing the problem might<br>> > not be on my end, I checked the relation.<br>> ><br>> >To my horror, the very same user decided to outright delete all relations<br>> > that were related to the maritime border I set up around Dokdo, and then<br>> > some. Here's the changeset:<br>> ><br>> >http://www.openstreetmap.org/browse/changeset/12829541<br>> ><br>> >Basically, this guy had the balls to delete the relations for the admin<br>> >
borders for the entire South Korea, as well as Gyeongbuk, Gangwon, and<br>> > the Dokdo itself.<br>> ><br>> >I was able to restore the data up to the previous saved point for now, but<br>> > some progress on Gyeongbuk has been lost.<br>> ><br>> >I fear that this may not be the end of the story, as the Japanese<br>> > government has sharply increased the rhetoric on the claim that<br>> > Dokdo(a.k.a. Takeshima) is its territory in the recent weeks as a<br>> > retaliation against the South Korean president visiting the island. I've<br>> > seen similar instances of vandalism on Wikipedia already.<br>> ><br>> >The problem has been reported to OSM's mediator, but I'm not sure if that<br>> > would do any good if this ever escalates.<br>> ><br>> >I realize that many of you who are doing map edits on South Korea are of<br>> > foreign nationality. So I can't simply
ask you to just take my side, but<br>> > I think everyone should know what's going on. At the least, please help<br>> > restore data points that are supposed to be unrelated to these spats if<br>> > they ever get deleted like this.<br>> ><br>> >Thank you.<br>> ><br>> >- Wesley (OSM: Namuori)<br>> ><br>> >_______________________________________________<br>> >Talk-ko mailing list<br>> ><a ymailto="mailto:Talk-ko@openstreetmap.org" href="mailto:Talk-ko@openstreetmap.org">Talk-ko@openstreetmap.org</a><br>> ><a href="http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-ko" target="_blank">http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-ko</a><br><br><br><br><br> </div> </div> </blockquote></div> </div></body></html>