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On 12/09/2010 01:31 PM, Michał Borsuk wrote:
<blockquote
cite="mid:AANLkTi=x7vcbSZGpW8KuOxR_AadHrYFu-oL=oAJej+5m@mail.gmail.com"
type="cite"><br>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">On 8 December 2010 20:44, Dominik Mahrer
(Teddy) <span dir="ltr"><<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:teddy@teddy.ch">teddy@teddy.ch</a>></span>
wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt
0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204);
padding-left: 1ex;">
Hello<br>
<br>
Yes, the Public Transport proposal is basically based on
Oxomoa, but in some details different.<br>
</blockquote>
<div><br>
</div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt
0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204);
padding-left: 1ex;">
I do not care about which of the two proposals will be
approved. But I think it is time to get a more exact schema
approved then the fuzzy/non-existing schema (A railway station
of 400m length and 20 platforms or a bus stop for 3 buses per
direction of 50m length is reduced to one node) we have now.<br
clear="all">
</blockquote>
</div>
<br>
There is the issue of "multiple relations per line" in oxomoa,
which in my opinion is a total misfit. There are "roles" in
relations, and different variants of a route can be put there. </blockquote>
My previous post to this list contains an example of what you may
encounter in real life. The case of a telescope line may be
representable in a single relation, but I really do not know how to
express in a single relation that some courses skip part of the
route (the market example) and follow another (including some
different stops) instead. If you have a decent way of expressing
that in a single relation, please do share it here - I'd happily
adopt that if only someone suggests a satisfactory solution to the
issue. <br>
<blockquote
cite="mid:AANLkTi=x7vcbSZGpW8KuOxR_AadHrYFu-oL=oAJej+5m@mail.gmail.com"
type="cite">Two, or more, relations per line is not only "illegal"
(clearly against the principle, as it was stated by its creators),
but also hell to administer, and JOSM-limited.</blockquote>
Are you referring to the master relation which contains the
relations for the route variants? In fact I don't use them in Milan
(in Munich it seems common practice and I follow that), and as of
today renderers seem to be fine even without it. Take the following
example:<br>
<br>
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://78.46.81.38/api/sketch-line?network=SITAM&ref=69&style=padua">http://78.46.81.38/api/sketch-line?network=SITAM&ref=69&style=padua</a><br>
<br>
This line is made up of four relations (two variants with one
relation for each direction), and OSM Server Side Script manages to
put them together based on their ref and network tags. Obviously,
the individual relations must have all the tags that would otherwise
go into the master relation.<br>
<br>
Or do you mean the fact that there are two (or more) relations per
line? It is true that it means more effort, which is why I would
happily consolidate the information into a single route if this were
doable without losing information.<br>
<br>
Editor support, as Dominik writes, I would not overestimate. JOSM
may be complex, but maintaining public transportation routes is
complex on itself - someone doing that is quite likely to use JOSM
anyway. I don't really see a reason against using JOSM - Potlatch in
my opinion is for the occasional mapper or for very quick edits;
Merkaartor may have some performance benefits (being a native
application) but JOSM still has satisfactory performance.<br>
<blockquote
cite="mid:AANLkTi=x7vcbSZGpW8KuOxR_AadHrYFu-oL=oAJej+5m@mail.gmail.com"
type="cite"> Potlatch and Merkaartor account for 2/3 edits
together. <br>
</blockquote>
Now this does surprise me - I would have expected a higher "market
share" for JOSM. If you have the figures at hand, it would be
interesting to find out how many of the people who edit public
transportation data use JOSM vs. other editors.<br>
<br>
Then again - if other editors do not support all that's possible, we
should also consider adapting the editors to support the tagging
scheme we have in mind rather than adapting the tagging scheme to
what is supported by all editors.<br>
<br>
Michael<br>
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