<META HTTP-EQUIV="Content-Type" CONTENT="text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1">
<html xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:w="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:m="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/2004/12/omml" xmlns="http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-html40"><head><meta name=Generator content="Microsoft Word 14 (filtered medium)"><style><!--
/* Font Definitions */
@font-face
{font-family:Calibri;
panose-1:2 15 5 2 2 2 4 3 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:Tahoma;
panose-1:2 11 6 4 3 5 4 4 2 4;}
/* Style Definitions */
p.MsoNormal, li.MsoNormal, div.MsoNormal
{margin:0in;
margin-bottom:.0001pt;
font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:"Times New Roman","serif";}
a:link, span.MsoHyperlink
{mso-style-priority:99;
color:blue;
text-decoration:underline;}
a:visited, span.MsoHyperlinkFollowed
{mso-style-priority:99;
color:purple;
text-decoration:underline;}
p
{mso-style-priority:99;
mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
margin-right:0in;
mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;
margin-left:0in;
font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:"Times New Roman","serif";}
p.MsoAcetate, li.MsoAcetate, div.MsoAcetate
{mso-style-priority:99;
mso-style-link:"Balloon Text Char";
margin:0in;
margin-bottom:.0001pt;
font-size:8.0pt;
font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";}
span.EmailStyle18
{mso-style-type:personal-reply;
font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D;}
span.BalloonTextChar
{mso-style-name:"Balloon Text Char";
mso-style-priority:99;
mso-style-link:"Balloon Text";
font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";}
.MsoChpDefault
{mso-style-type:export-only;
font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";}
@page WordSection1
{size:8.5in 11.0in;
margin:1.0in 1.0in 1.0in 1.0in;}
div.WordSection1
{page:WordSection1;}
--></style><!--[if gte mso 9]><xml>
<o:shapedefaults v:ext="edit" spidmax="1026" />
</xml><![endif]--><!--[if gte mso 9]><xml>
<o:shapelayout v:ext="edit">
<o:idmap v:ext="edit" data="1" />
</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body lang=EN-US link=blue vlink=purple><div class=WordSection1><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>To be clear, you do *<b>not</b>* have a license for this data but are relying on fair use and your opinion of what is copyrighted?<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Also, are you relying on the fact that others haven’t gotten into trouble as support for this import being legally okay?<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div style='border:none;border-left:solid blue 1.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt'><div><div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> Mike Dupont [mailto:jamesmikedupont@googlemail.com] <br><b>Sent:</b> Friday, December 21, 2012 6:51 PM<br><b>To:</b> Paul Norman<br><b>Cc:</b> imports; talk-us@openstreetmap.org<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [Imports] [Talk-us] shawnee county landuse<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal>Well we can remove the names of the lbcs codes, I left them for now because it is very useful for editing. I am using them to search while editing etc. <o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal>Well the amount of data we are extracting is very very limited, I see this as basic fair use and factual information. The county gis officer knows what I am doing and did not say anything. The data should be easy to delete if needed.<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>Right now I am still working out the tagging of the various nodes, and when it all done we will remove the lbcs data when it is no longer needed.<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>This is all work in progress, but already the osm database is better than google and other databases, I have been removing misplaced tags and nodes. <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>Also on the issue of violation of the kansas law, trulia and zillow and many others have real copies of this data in a much more commercial manner and I dont see that they are getting in trouble. I dont think it will be a big issue.<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>mike<o:p></o:p></p></div></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal>On Fri, Dec 21, 2012 at 8:41 PM, Paul Norman <<a href="mailto:penorman@mac.com" target="_blank">penorman@mac.com</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>You are proposing importing both the code *<b>and</b>* the description of the code. Why both? </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>For that matter, why either at all? A user isn’t going to know what to do with it when editing the other tags.</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>I can’t see a link to the license on the wiki. Could you please provide one. A lack of a license does not indicate public domain. Some counties consider their geodata to be PD, some don’t. It’s likely that Shawanee does, but there’s no confirmation of that that I see.</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>The K.S.A. 45-220(c)(2)(B) declaration is a bit odd. It doesn’t seem to match up exactly with K.S.A. 45-230 which is titled “unlawful use of names derived from public records.”</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Remember, ODbL like any open license (e.g. CC BY, CC0, CC BY-SA, etc) allows people to resell the data. Someone could take the OSM address data and do a mass mailing based on it.</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>I guess *<b>you</b>* might get into trouble based on it but the person doing so would probably be okay since they didn’t make the K.S.A. 45-220(c)(2) certification.</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><div style='border:none;border-left:solid blue 1.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt'><div><div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> Mike Dupont [mailto:<a href="mailto:jamesmikedupont@googlemail.com" target="_blank">jamesmikedupont@googlemail.com</a>] <br><b>Sent:</b> Friday, December 21, 2012 9:51 AM<br><b>To:</b> Martin Koppenhöfer<br><b>Cc:</b> Paul Norman; imports; <a href="mailto:talk-us@openstreetmap.org" target="_blank">talk-us@openstreetmap.org</a><br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [Imports] [Talk-us] shawnee county landuse</span><o:p></o:p></p></div></div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>I have added the info to the wiki<o:p></o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><a href="https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Kansas/Shawnee_County/Import" target="_blank">https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Kansas/Shawnee_County/Import</a><o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>also the scripts are updated. I am been manually replacing the plot info with just the building, so the only info being imported are the house numbers and zip codes and the lbcs tags. Also for the new script, I create a single point with the average location of the points making up the plot and then manually place that on top of the major building manually. this checks the data and also basically removes all data being copied, everything is only just the basic facts. <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>mike<o:p></o:p></p></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>On Sun, Dec 16, 2012 at 7:14 AM, Mike Dupont <<a href="mailto:jamesmikedupont@googlemail.com" target="_blank">jamesmikedupont@googlemail.com</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>On Sun, Dec 16, 2012 at 2:09 AM, Martin Koppenhöfer <<a href="mailto:dieterdreist@gmail.com" target="_blank">dieterdreist@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt'><br><br>Am 15/dic/2012 um 22:39 schrieb Mike Dupont <<a href="mailto:jamesmikedupont@googlemail.com" target="_blank">jamesmikedupont@googlemail.com</a>>:<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>3.</span><span style='font-size:7.0pt;color:#1F497D'> </span><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>What tagging are you proposing?</span><o:p></o:p></p></div></div></blockquote><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>addr:* and landuse<br>the only additional tag are the four detailed landuse tags<br>eg <br>lbcs:activity:code {1100=1}<br>lbcs:activity:name {Household activities=1}<br>lbcs:function:code {1170=1}<br>lbcs:function:name {Garden apartment complex (1=1}<br><br>These codes are details on how the lot is zoned. otherwise I am using this information for fixing the street names and zip codes. <o:p></o:p></p></div></blockquote></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>Are the landuses you plan to tag actual landuses or permitted/planned landuses?<o:p></o:p></p></div></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><br>These are actual landuses, the ones that describe the business.<br>when you register a business here in kansas, you have to provide this information. <br><a href="https://www.kansas.gov/bess/flow/main?execution=e1s1" target="_blank">https://www.kansas.gov/bess/flow/main?execution=e1s1</a><br><br>I will also be looking into how that data can be extracted and compared some day. This is more than zoning infomation.<br>If you look at this for example : <a href="http://www.snco.us/Ap/C_prop/Listing.asp?PRCL_ID=0973604030001000" target="_blank">http://www.snco.us/Ap/C_prop/Listing.asp?PRCL_ID=0973604030001000</a><br><br>"2151-Grocery store / supermarket" <br>"2110-Goods-oriented shopping"<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt'>that is very accurate and could be used for direct tag information.<br><br>there is a building layer on the snco gis site, but I have not figured out how to extract it, it seems to be hidden. So I am tracing them from bing.<br><a href="http://gis.snco.us/ArcGIS/rest/services/Basemap_102100/MapServer/7" target="_blank">http://gis.snco.us/ArcGIS/rest/services/Basemap_102100/MapServer/7</a><br><a href="http://gis.snco.us/ArcGIS/rest/services/Basemap_102100/MapServer/8" target="_blank">http://gis.snco.us/ArcGIS/rest/services/Basemap_102100/MapServer/8</a><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>4.</span><span style='font-size:7.0pt;color:#1F497D'> </span><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>The last few times someone has proposed importing property lot data the consensus has been that that type of data shouldn’t be imported into OSM. Why is this different?</span><o:p></o:p></p></div></div></blockquote><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>I am importing the plots for zipcode, house number and address data. It is being used to tag the buildings, it can be deleted when it has been totally processed. <o:p></o:p></p></div></blockquote><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>IMHO addresses belong (often) to plots, so in these cases there is no point in transferring the address information to a building. Don't remember consensus to not import property limits. I do remember though that there were concerns about the sheer amount of data increase if we imported this for the whole world.<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>Cheers,<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>Martin<o:p></o:p></p></div></div></blockquote></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><br>Well these are plots/property limits. And I dont want to import them for the whole world, just the streets that I am tracing buildings from so that I can quickly find locations. Also did you notice that <a href="http://nominatim.openstreetmap.org/" target="_blank">http://nominatim.openstreetmap.org/</a> can now find house numbers accurately for these streets I imported : <o:p></o:p></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><a href="http://nominatim.openstreetmap.org/search.php?q=2033+Southwest+Wanamaker+Rd%2C+Topeka%2C+Kansas&viewbox=-217.97%2C80.28%2C217.97%2C-70.31" target="_blank">http://nominatim.openstreetmap.org/search.php?q=2033+Southwest+Wanamaker+Rd%2C+Topeka%2C+Kansas&viewbox=-217.97%2C80.28%2C217.97%2C-70.31</a><br><br>Until the houses are traced and the data transfered like i did here :<br><br><a href="http://www.openstreetmap.org/browse/way/196582551" target="_blank">http://www.openstreetmap.org/browse/way/196582551</a> I removed the plot and the lbcs data and left only the house itself.<br>I forgot the landuse=residential. <br clear=all><o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><br>-- <br>James Michael DuPont<br>Member of Free Libre Open Source Software Kosova <a href="http://flossk.org" target="_blank">http://flossk.org</a><br>Saving wikipedia(tm) articles from deletion <a href="http://SpeedyDeletion.wikia.com" target="_blank">http://SpeedyDeletion.wikia.com</a><br>Contributor FOSM, the CC-BY-SA map of the world <a href="http://fosm.org" target="_blank">http://fosm.org</a><br>Mozilla Rep <a href="https://reps.mozilla.org/u/h4ck3rm1k3" target="_blank">https://reps.mozilla.org/u/h4ck3rm1k3</a><br>Free Software Foundation Europe Fellow <a href="http://fsfe.org/support/?h4ck3rm1k3" target="_blank">http://fsfe.org/support/?h4ck3rm1k3</a><o:p></o:p></p></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><br><br clear=all><o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>-- <br>James Michael DuPont<br>Member of Free Libre Open Source Software Kosova <a href="http://flossk.org" target="_blank">http://flossk.org</a><br>Saving wikipedia(tm) articles from deletion <a href="http://SpeedyDeletion.wikia.com" target="_blank">http://SpeedyDeletion.wikia.com</a><br>Contributor FOSM, the CC-BY-SA map of the world <a href="http://fosm.org" target="_blank">http://fosm.org</a><br>Mozilla Rep <a href="https://reps.mozilla.org/u/h4ck3rm1k3" target="_blank">https://reps.mozilla.org/u/h4ck3rm1k3</a><br>Free Software Foundation Europe Fellow <a href="http://fsfe.org/support/?h4ck3rm1k3" target="_blank">http://fsfe.org/support/?h4ck3rm1k3</a> <o:p></o:p></p></div></div></div></div></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><br><br clear=all><o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal>-- <br>James Michael DuPont<br>Member of Free Libre Open Source Software Kosova <a href="http://flossk.org" target="_blank">http://flossk.org</a><br>Saving wikipedia(tm) articles from deletion <a href="http://SpeedyDeletion.wikia.com" target="_blank">http://SpeedyDeletion.wikia.com</a><br>Contributor FOSM, the CC-BY-SA map of the world <a href="http://fosm.org" target="_blank">http://fosm.org</a><br>Mozilla Rep <a href="https://reps.mozilla.org/u/h4ck3rm1k3" target="_blank">https://reps.mozilla.org/u/h4ck3rm1k3</a><br>Free Software Foundation Europe Fellow <a href="http://fsfe.org/support/?h4ck3rm1k3" target="_blank">http://fsfe.org/support/?h4ck3rm1k3</a> <o:p></o:p></p></div></div></div></body></html>