<!doctype html public "-//W3C//DTD W3 HTML//EN">
<html><head><style type="text/css"><!--
blockquote, dl, ul, ol, li { padding-top: 0 ; padding-bottom: 0 }
--></style><title>Re: [Talk-us] USA Rail: Calling all OSM railfans!
(especia</title></head><body>
<div>Peter Dobratz writes:</div>
<blockquote type="cite" cite>I don't see any specific information
about exactly how one would go about identifying specific railways in
Oregon so that they could be added to relations.</blockquote>
<div><br></div>
<div>Yes, Peter: I did that on purpose because I want to
encourage OSM mappers to develop their own methods for
"discovering" the names of rail subdivisions. One way
I did this in California was to use our state's Public Utilities
Commission (PUCs are state agencies that regulate railroads and other
public utilities) "Road/Rail Crossing Spreadsheet."
Oregon's PUC likely has something similar (as should all other
states). It shows all Road/Rail crossings in the state, along
with the name of the subdivision/rail line. If you sort the
sheet by the subdivision/line name, then milepost, you can essentially
trace the rail line along known (already in OSM)
streets/avenues/boulevards. This allows you to reverse engineer
the name of an existing (TIGER-entered, poorly named) rail line in OSM
as you can identify it by known landmarks (streets).</div>
<div><br></div>
<div>Part of the reason I do this is because other places you might
"discover" these data (subdivision names) are maps published
by the rail corporations. But, be careful. For example, I
have found that when I go to Union Pacific's web site to get a page
that displays their network map, I get a "login screen" or a
very high-zoom level map which is clearly copyright protected, meaning
OSM cannot enter those data. However, a map I found on BNSF's
web site [1] is clearly NOT copyright protected, so I believe I can
use those data. These are usually very high-zoom level maps,
meaning they are only useful to "confirm" that an existing
line (again, from TIGER) has a certain name. They are not
sufficient/detailed enough to enter the rail data from scratch.</div>
<div><br></div>
<blockquote type="cite" cite>Are there signs on the ground with these
things?</blockquote>
<div><br></div>
<div>No, there are usually not. Occasionally you will see a sign
that says something like "Entering Seabright Block" but
these are often traffic signalling areas, not entire subdivisions
which are usually long -- hundreds of km -- stretches of contiguous
rail. However, this doesn't mean that they are unnamed, just
poorly signed. Rail companies name them internally, but because
rail companies are regulated, they report these names to PUCs, and
therefore "give them" to the public. It's just that
the data can be difficult to discern. Persevere!</div>
<div><br></div>
<blockquote type="cite" cite>For the railways, Paul may be objecting
to the content of the name and ref tag on the Way objects themselves
for the railway. However, it is not clear how to find out what
the name actually should be. The wiki page does indicate that
the name tag on the Way objects should match the name tag on the
Relation object with type=route and route=railway tags. For many
rails around Portland, these Relations (type=route, route=railway)
have not yet been created.</blockquote>
<div><br></div>
<div>Yup. So: 1) "Discover" the correct
names for rail infrastructure segments, 2) Tag them as such (usually
the existing TIGER name= correctly can become the operator= tag), 3)
Give them a usage= tag and 4) Collect into a route=railway relation
identically named rail segments. That is the important work that
has been underway in California (and many other states) for the past
several months. Especially if usage= tags are also applied to
rail segments, ORM will display these with a pleasing contiguous
line. Yes, usage= tags can be a bit nebulous to determine, too,
just do your best using these [2] guidelines.</div>
<div><br></div>
<blockquote type="cite" cite>You mention 2 specific examples
(type=route; route=railway): Brooklyn Subdivision (<a
href="http://www.osm.org/relation/2203588"
>http://www.osm.org/relation/2203588</a>) and Fallbridge Subdivision (<a
href="http://www.osm.org/relation/1443651"
>http://www.osm.org/relation/1443651</a>). Some of the Way
objects in Fallbridge Subdivision are also contained in <a
href="http://www.osm.org/relation/4734792"
>http://www.osm.org/relation/4734792</a>. Both of the relations
for Fallbridge Subdivision have FIXME tags expressing uncertainty
about exactly where the route Relation should begin and end. How
would one determine the exact end of the Relation for the Fallbridge
Subdivision?</blockquote>
<div><br></div>
<div>It looks like I made an error by adding 4734792, as I didn't see
the existing 1443651. I believe this is a forgivable mistake,
and I'm sorry I made it. I will remove 4734792 forthwith.
Regarding how to determine where the exact boundaries are: I
can't give you a perfect answer in every case. Often,
subdivisions begin and end at a yard, a junction or a station, but not
always. The rail owner gets to say definitively, and again, the
PUC should document this (somewhere).</div>
<div><br></div>
<blockquote type="cite" cite>Also, looking through the history of the
above relations, I can't really find anything in the changeset tags
regarding the source of the data about the railroads. Where do
the names Brooklyn Subdivision and Fallbridge Subdivision come
from?</blockquote>
<div><br></div>
<div>The names come from the rail company/owner of the line.
Especially for rail with passenger routes, this will often be a public
agency, like a state Department of Transportation or a local transit
authority.</div>
<div><br></div>
<blockquote type="cite" cite>Paul mentions that we should be using the
name "Banfield Mainline" but where does that name come from
and what exactly does it refer to?</blockquote>
<div><br></div>
<div>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MAX_Light_Rail should explain it, or
at least introduce it. You might address Paul directly with this
question.</div>
<div><br></div>
<div>I am happy to answer other specific questions, but let's take
them off-list. We can re-post if needed.</div>
<div><br></div>
<div>SteveA</div>
<div>California</div>
<div><br></div>
<div>[1]
http://www.bnsf.com/customers/pdf/maps/subdivisions-map.pdf</div>
<div>[2]
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/OpenRailwayMap/Tagging_in_North_Am<span
></span>erica#Route_Importance</div>
</body>
</html>