<div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><br></div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Wed, Sep 23, 2020 at 6:22 PM Andy Townsend <<a href="mailto:ajt1047@gmail.com">ajt1047@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
  
    
  
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    <div>On 24/09/2020 00:00, Paul Johnson
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          <div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Wed, Sep 23, 2020 at 5:56
            PM Andy Townsend <<a href="mailto:ajt1047@gmail.com" target="_blank">ajt1047@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br>
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              <div>On 23/09/2020 23:01, Paul Johnson wrote:<br>
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                    <div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Wed, Sep 23,
                      2020 at 4:37 PM stevea <<a href="mailto:steveaOSM@softworkers.com" target="_blank">steveaOSM@softworkers.com</a>>
                      wrote:<br>
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                    <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">Paul Johnson
                      <<a href="mailto:baloo@ursamundi.org" target="_blank">baloo@ursamundi.org</a>>
                      wrote: <br>
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                    <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"> > 2.
                      Tagging route information on ways.  It's about a
                      decade too long at this point for ref=* on a way
                      to be completely disconnected from the entity the
                      tag applies to:  That's why route relations
                      exist.  Biggest problem child on this at the
                      moment:  OSM's own tilesets.  Let's drop rendering
                      for ref=* on ways and just render the route
                      relations already, this and multipolygons are why
                      relations came to exist in the first place.<br>
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                      Yes, 100% agreement.  I think this is simply pure
                      inertia (the kind that says "broken process") on
                      the part of renderers.<br>
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                      Can anybody (renderer authors included, maybe even
                      especially) are welcome to offer reasons why "the
                      old machinery" remains in place?  Are there legacy
                      use cases that remain unclear to the wider
                      community?  Please tell us here, if so.<br>
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              <p>The US is unusual in that it doesn't have a single ref
                per section of road.  Most places in OSM map what they
                see on the ground, and the current OSM Carto rendering
                works just fine for them</p>
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          <div>Right up until there's more than one kind of route on the
            way. <br>
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    <p>No-one's disputing that this is a major problem for mappers in
      the US - I'm just saying that it's really not a major problem in
      most other places.  That doesn't make it any less of a problem in
      the US but does help to explain why people elsewhere seem not to
      see it as a problem.<br></p></div></blockquote><div>I don't mean just route=road, literally any other route. </div></div></div>