<html><head></head><body><div class="ydp6f786cbfyahoo-style-wrap" style="font-family:Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif;font-size:16px;"><div><div dir="ltr" data-setdir="false">Hi Joost</div><div dir="ltr" data-setdir="false"><br></div><div dir="ltr" data-setdir="false">Looks cool !</div><div dir="ltr" data-setdir="false">I would like to discuss tagging issues and more with you, but during the next month I will be too busy... </div><div><br></div><div class="ydp6f786cbfsignature"><div style="font-family:Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif;font-size:16px;">-- <div>Regards / Kveðja / Kila la heri / Hilsen </div><div>Morten Lange, Oslo, Norway</div></div></div></div>
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On Monday, 10 August 2020, 16:57:52 CEST, joost schouppe <joost.schouppe@gmail.com> wrote:
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<div><div id="ydp9f19ab08yiv5923565818"><div><div dir="ltr"><div>Hi Morten,</div><div><br clear="none"></div><div>The site works without a database, so requires very little upkeep. The team that worked on it is very enthusiastic about the project and at least four of the five people who built this during Open Summer of Code are still involved as volunteers. Our partners from the government also seem quite enthused to keep using it on some of their websites, and friends at the pro-cycle movement were also inspired. We are looking for ways to be able to keep working on this in a more structural way, but for now I suspect our enthusiasm will keep it afloat. The tool is now already in production for two "official" projects.<br clear="none"></div><div><br clear="none"></div><div>For cyclofix, there's some things in my personal backlog:</div><div>- add all the layers here: <a shape="rect" href="https://cyclofix.osm.be/docs/using-data-map/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">https://cyclofix.osm.be/docs/using-data-map/</a> (now there's an example for "where to buy a bike", but all the layers should be explained there)</div><div>- add more info to the public wiki - most of our thinking is described here <a shape="rect" href="https://github.com/osmbe/cyclofix-website/issues/4" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">https://github.com/osmbe/cyclofix-website/issues/4</a> , and I have been editing the wiki to make some things clearer. I also aim to extend this page <a shape="rect" href="https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:service:bicycle" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:service:bicycle</a></div><div><br clear="none"></div><div>With Pieter Fiers, we've also been thinking about creating a proposal for a pub subtag, which could be used to refine cafe and pub with a certain "style"; e.g. "an Irish pub" or a "cyclist oriented pub". For now we just say "if it is a pub/cafe and has cycle services or a cycling club, it's a cycle café"</div><div><br clear="none"></div><div>I believe Pieter Vander Vennet also has some ideas on how to make the overpass-queries behind the data more visible to end users, so the "real OSM people" can easily get an idea of our choices.</div><div><br clear="none"></div><div>We have tried to keep the entire Cyclofix project documented and easily replicable (including "how to organise a cyclofix mapping party") on <a shape="rect" href="https://cyclofix.osm.be/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">https://cyclofix.osm.be/</a></div><div><br clear="none"></div><div>If you want to be a little more closely involved: most of our team is included in community (at) <a shape="rect" href="http://osm.be" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">osm.be</a> , and we've also created a Matrix chatroom.<br clear="none"></div><div><br clear="none"></div><div>Best,</div><div>Joost<br clear="none"></div></div><br clear="none"><div class="ydp9f19ab08yiv5923565818gmail_quote"><div class="ydp9f19ab08yiv5923565818gmail_attr" dir="ltr">Op ma 10 aug. 2020 om 16:07 schreef Morten Lange via talk <<a shape="rect" href="mailto:talk@openstreetmap.org" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">talk@openstreetmap.org</a>>:<br clear="none"></div><blockquote class="ydp9f19ab08yiv5923565818gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex;"><div class="ydp9f19ab08yiv5923565818yqt3326678940" id="ydp9f19ab08yiv5923565818yqt97726"><div><div style="font-family:Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif;font-size:16px;"><div><div dir="ltr">Thanks for your hepful response (below).</div><div dir="ltr">And sorry that I "re-sent" my questions in a slightly different way.</div><div dir="ltr"><br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr">However, there were two new points. <br clear="none">One question about the life expectancy of the current site </div><div dir="ltr">and one suggestion or inspiration (By some possibly perceived as wishful thinking): </div><div dir="ltr"><br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"><div><span style="font-family:Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif;font-size:16px;">I enjoyed testing your solution, and I would like to announce it to others to try. </span><br clear="none" style="font-family:Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif;font-size:16px;"><span style="font-family:Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif;font-size:16px;">But I suppose continued operation of the current site is uncertain?</span><br clear="none" style="font-family:Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif;font-size:16px;"><span style="font-family:Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif;font-size:16px;">That fact(?) holds me back a bit, except for "geeks" and bicycle+map affectionados. </span><br clear="none" style="font-family:Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif;font-size:16px;"><span style="font-family:Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif;font-size:16px;"><br clear="none"></span></div><div dir="ltr">Ideally The European Cyclists Federation or even UNEP or some other big organisation would offer to support operations of such a site, and cater for large traffic loads and continued development for, say, a 10 year period :-) <br clear="none">In the larger picture the costs would be quie low! </div></div><div dir="ltr"><br clear="none"></div><div><div style="font-family:Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif;font-size:16px;">-- <div>Regards / Kveðja / Kila la heri / Hilsen </div><div>Morten Lange</div></div></div></div>
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On Sunday, 9 August 2020, 16:25:52 CEST, Pieter Fiers <<a shape="rect" href="mailto:pieter@pfiers.net" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">pieter@pfiers.net</a>> wrote:
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> Congratulations on a nice project and a useful one !
<div dir="ltr">> For a long time I have
wished for a user-friendly bicycle repair specific map, including
bicycle cafés.<br clear="none">
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Thanks, us as well ;)<br clear="none">
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> What I miss in the Cyclofix project is an easy-to find
definition of how you classify the nodes that are to be included in
the different map "layers". <br clear="none">
> Which search is it that produces the bicycle cafés. (And what
takes precedence if two or more criteria are fulfilled?)<br clear="none">
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An excellent question, and something we want to improve in a future
version (the discoverability and ease-of-use of the "layer"
definitions). <br clear="none">
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To answer the bicycle cafés question in the context of the current
version: <br clear="none">
Take a look at <a shape="rect" href="https://github.com/pietervdvn/MapComplete/blob/master/Customizations/Layers/BikeCafes.ts#L23" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">https://github.com/pietervdvn/MapComplete/blob/master/Customizations/Layers/BikeCafes.ts#L23</a>.
That overpass filter/query can basically be written as: "a
pub/bar/cafe with pub=cycling or any bicycle:service" (<a shape="rect" href="https://overpass-turbo.eu/s/WSU" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">https://overpass-turbo.eu/s/WSU</a>).<br clear="none">
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With regards to precedence, both POI's would be shown (not ideal).
With the current definitions this might happen if there's an overlap
on shop=<span>bicycle, amenity=pub/bar/cafe,
amenity=bicycle_parking or </span><span>amenity=</span><span>bicycle_repair_station.</span><br clear="none">
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> I agree with making a distinction between "pure" bicycle shops
and general sport shops that offer bicycles or repair of bicycles.
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For "pure" bicycle shops we use shop=bicycle, for "other" shops
(general sports equipment stores) we use shop=* + any
bicycle:service:* tag.<br clear="none">
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We're excited for the future and we're continuing work on making the
project more user-friendly and approachable!<br clear="none">
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Thanks for the kind words and with kind regards,<br clear="none">
Pieter Fiers<br clear="none">
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<div id="ydp9f19ab08yiv5923565818gmail-m_8021155651014871355ydpeacb4124yiv4849839516yqt51011"><div>On 05/08/2020 00:39, Morten Lange
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<div dir="ltr">Congratulations on a nice project and a
useful one !</div>
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<div dir="ltr">For a long time I
have wished for a user-friendly bicycle repair
specific map, including bicycle cafés.</div>
<div dir="ltr"><br clear="none">
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<div dir="ltr">What I miss in the
Cyclofix project is an easy-to find definition of how
you classify the nodes that are to be included in the
differewnt map "layers". Which search is it that
produces the bicycle cafés. (And what takes precedence
if two or more criteria are fulfilled?)</div>
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<div dir="ltr">I agree with making a
distinction between "pure" bicycle shops and general
sport shops that offer bicycles or repair of
bicycles. <br clear="none">
However, the way Cyclofix has decided to differentiate
is not self-evident to me, after briefly checking your
documentation. I must admit that I did not really
consider looking at the source-code ;-) </div>
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<div style="font-family:Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif;font-size:16px;">--
<div>Regards / Kveðja / Kila la heri / Hilsen </div>
<div>Morten Lange</div>
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<div> On Wednesday, 29 July 2020, 19:43:38 CEST, Pieter Fiers
<a shape="rect" href="mailto:pieter@pfiers.net" rel="nofollow" target="_blank"><pieter@pfiers.net></a> wrote: </div>
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<div dir="ltr"><span><font style="background-color:inherit;" color="#000000">Dear
OSM community, </font></span>
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<div>My name is Pierre Barban. A team composed of three
very motivated students, including myself, and lead by
two active members of the OSMbe, have been mandated by
the region of Brussels, Belgium, to create a map
gathering all kind of data related to cycling. Without
a doubt, OpenStreetMap was the perfect tool for us to
create a powerful platform that would sustain over the
years. </div>
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<div>In the framework of month-long online code camp
organized by the non-profit <a shape="rect" href="https://be.okfn.org/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Open
Knowledge Belgium</a>, we have been able to
establish the first version of the <a shape="rect" href="https://cyclofix.osm.be/map/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">tool</a>,
organized a <a shape="rect" href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C5dVjDt5QAE" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">mapathon</a> to collect data,
and create a complete <a shape="rect" href="https://cyclofix.osm.be/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">website</a> to
document the entire making process. </div>
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<div><font color="#000000">In accordance with the OSM
core values, it would be very valuable for our
project as well as our individual learning process
to receive as many constructive comments from the
community as possible. If you're interested in more
details about the project, we will be giving an <a shape="rect" href="https://www.eventbrite.be/e/open-summer-of-code-2020-demo-day-live-streaming-registration-112787885602" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">online presentation</a> tomorrow
July 30, 2020 at 1pm <span style="font-family:Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif;font-size:14px;">CEST</span>. We will
be available to directly discuss after the
presentation to receive feedback in order to keep
improving our project. Other related project
from our program, <a shape="rect" href="https://osoc.be/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Open Summer
of Code</a>, like the Bike Data Project - which
aims to collect and share cyclist commute data in an
opened way - will also be presented to you.</font></div>
<span><font style="background-color:inherit;" color="#000000"> </font></span>
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<div>Please do not hesitate to contact me for further
information,</div>
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<div>thank you for your time and help.</div>
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<div>Sincerely,</div>
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<div>Pierre Barban, from the Cyclofix project.<br clear="none">
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<i>Sent by Pieter Fiers <a shape="rect" href="mailto:pieter@pfiers.net" rel="nofollow" target="_blank"><pieter@pfiers.net></a>,
another student of the team.</i><br clear="none">
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<div dir="ltr"><span style="color:rgb(136,136,136);font-family:Arial, sans-serif;"><font style="background-color:inherit;" size="4" color="#3d85c6"><b>Pierre
Barban</b> </font></span><br clear="none" style="color:rgb(136,136,136);font-family:Arial, sans-serif;">
<div style="color:rgb(136,136,136);"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0);font-family:Arial, sans-serif;">University
Panthéon-Sorbonne Paris I – Class of
2020</span><br clear="none" style="font-family:Arial, sans-serif;">
<font face="Arial, sans-serif" color="#000000"><b>Masters in
Economics of Sustainable
Development</b></font><br clear="none" style="font-family:Arial, sans-serif;">
<span style="font-family:Arial, sans-serif;"><font style="background-color:inherit;" color="#000000"><a shape="rect" href="mailto:pierre.barban@gmail.com" style="color:rgb(17,85,204);" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">pierre.barban@gmail.com</a></font></span><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0);font-family:Arial, sans-serif;"> | +33 7 68 72
92 54<br clear="none">
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</span></div>
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</blockquote></div><br clear="all"><br clear="none">-- <br clear="none"><div class="ydp9f19ab08yiv5923565818gmail_signature" dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div><div dir="ltr"><div><div dir="ltr"><div><div dir="ltr">Joost Schouppe</div><div dir="ltr"><a shape="rect" href="http://www.openstreetmap.org/user/joost%20schouppe/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">OpenStreetMap</a> | <a shape="rect" href="https://twitter.com/joostjakob" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Twitter</a> | <a shape="rect" href="https://www.linkedin.com/pub/joost-schouppe/48/939/603" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">LinkedIn</a> | <a shape="rect" href="http://www.meetup.com/OpenStreetMap-Belgium/members/97979802/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Meetup</a></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div>
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