<div dir="auto">Perhaps we just need a wiki page with what has found to work.<div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">Something that tells you how to add a business simply using a smartphone.</div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">Cheerio John</div></div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Thu, Aug 19, 2021, 12:00 Rebecca Firth <<a href="mailto:rebecca.m.firth@gmail.com">rebecca.m.firth@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr">
<div>Hey John,</div><div><br></div><div>I think others have mentioned
the communications channels for OSM Africa are mainly outside of this
mailing list (WhatsApp, Telegram), so I guess having this discussion in
places where OSM Africa engagement is already vibrant would be a first start! <br></div><div><br></div><div>In
terms of local perspectives on mapping tools & needs, GeOsm is a
great initiative (homepage: <a href="https://geo.sm/" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">https://geo.sm/</a> & webinar:
<a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aqcWL5b9r9Y" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aqcWL5b9r9Y</a>). Maybe Willy might be
reading this and interested to add his thoughts. Also the HOT Tech Team
has developed this list of problem statements based on user research
with OSM communities and partners in many countries
<a href="https://docs.google.com/document/d/1dPWpvfBmodbbJMK8hnV4BNBSVLnAuw1FN94NwD4Rm6I/edit" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">https://docs.google.com/document/d/1dPWpvfBmodbbJMK8hnV4BNBSVLnAuw1FN94NwD4Rm6I/edit</a>
(caveat: I work for HOT - not specifically promoting this research or HOT, just sharing some of the problem
statements that have been developed based on user research!) <br></div><div><br></div><div>In
terms of a map maturity model, I like the concept of a way to
demonstrate and measure increasing map detail, but disagree with local
engagement happening at Level 4. Much OSM mapping in Africa is driven by
local individuals or local communities. I'd suggest we focus on
creating the enabling conditions for communities to grow and do their
own mapping. In case you're interested I created this example in the
past which shows increasing map quality over time:
<a href="https://twitter.com/RebeccaFirthy/status/1202952838722342912" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">https://twitter.com/RebeccaFirthy/status/1202952838722342912</a> (another caveat: this
was developed really quickly, and there are huge and glaring errors with
it, I'm not arguing for it or defending it's content at all - it's just an
example of a communications tool to show increasing map data)</div><div><br></div><div>Thanks,</div><div><br></div><div>Rebecca</div>
</div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Thu, Aug 19, 2021 at 3:38 PM john whelan <<a href="mailto:jwhelan0112@gmail.com" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">jwhelan0112@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div dir="auto">So how do we tap the local perspectives? There should be a few ideas floating around.<div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">I get the impression that capability and resources vary enormously. I note that </div><div dir="auto"><a href="https://opencitiesproject.org/" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">https://opencitiesproject.org/</a> is trying to use open data. Locally having open data with the correct licence has been very useful.<br></div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">Perhaps we need a maturity model along the lines of:</div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">Level 0 blank map.</div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">Level 1 most towns and major villages are mapped.</div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">Level 2 most settlements have names.</div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">Level 3 they have connecting highways.</div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">Level 4 the locals complain about the quality of mapping. This is interesting as it shows an interest and some knowledge of mapping.</div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">Cheerio John</div><div dir="auto"><br></div></div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Thu, Aug 19, 2021, 10:06 Rebecca Firth <<a href="mailto:rebecca.m.firth@gmail.com" rel="noreferrer noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">rebecca.m.firth@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr">
<div dir="auto">Hi,</div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">I just wanted to add some perspective on some of the statements in this thread</div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto"><span style="color:rgb(53,28,117)">> There are some smartphones in Africa but often internet access is expensive and poor.</span></div><div><br></div><div>The
phrase "some smartphones" is somewhat of an underestimation -
organisations like GSMA estimated 477 million mobile internet users in
Sub Saharan Africa alone at the end of 2019
(<a href="https://www.gsma.com/mobileeconomy/sub-saharan-africa/" rel="noreferrer noreferrer noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">https://www.gsma.com/mobileeconomy/sub-saharan-africa/</a>). Additionally
many countries have 'leapfrogged'
(<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leapfrogging" rel="noreferrer noreferrer noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leapfrogging</a>) fixed line & dated technology solutions, moving directly to much more advanced mobile solutions.
Internet access cost and quality is also hugely variable across the
whole world. Growth in OSM local editing requires local perspective
& with that, acknowledgement of the specific context of a particular
place, rather than generalisations.<br></div><div><br></div><div><span style="color:rgb(53,28,117)">> I don't think the ability to draw in highways is essential but being able to paste a preset building outline might be nice. If possible it needs to display the local region and by local I mean say twenty kilometre square.</span></div><div><br></div><div>I
absolutely agree that we need more frictionless ways to contribute to
OpenStreetMap on mobile in order to increase local edits (quantity &
quality). We should focus on listening to the objectives of local
communities before jumping to technology solutions,<br></div><div><br></div><div>Thanks, and interested in others perspectives on this,<br></div><div><br></div><div>Rebecca</div>
</div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Wed, Aug 18, 2021 at 6:10 PM john whelan <<a href="mailto:jwhelan0112@gmail.com" rel="noreferrer noreferrer noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">jwhelan0112@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div dir="auto"><div>I think I hadn't looked at Vespucci for a while but looking at it now it looks much improved. I like the fact you can vary the amount of map you download.</div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">Complexity I think is just a matter of documentation. I ran a session with new mappers and JOSM once with the buildings_tool. I just taught them what they needed to be able to add buildings.</div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">Thanks John</div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto"><br><div class="gmail_quote" dir="auto"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Wed, Aug 18, 2021, 12:45 Mateusz Konieczny via talk <<a href="mailto:talk@openstreetmap.org" rel="noreferrer noreferrer noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">talk@openstreetmap.org</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<div>
<div><br></div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div>Aug 18, 2021, 17:31 by <a href="mailto:jwhelan0112@gmail.com" rel="noreferrer noreferrer noreferrer noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">jwhelan0112@gmail.com</a>:<br></div><blockquote style="border-left:1px solid rgb(147,163,184);padding-left:10px;margin-left:5px"><div dir="auto"><div>We can do a fair bit of remote mapping but at the end of the day it works better with local input.<br></div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">There are some smartphones in Africa but often internet access is expensive and poor.<br></div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">What is available?<br></div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">Osmand is not too bad but I note it's power demands are growing on the OSMand mailing list.<br></div></div></blockquote><div dir="auto">See <a href="https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Editors" rel="noopener noreferrer noreferrer noreferrer noreferrer noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Editors</a><br></div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">Android:<br></div><div dir="auto"><a href="https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Vespucci" rel="noopener noreferrer noreferrer noreferrer noreferrer noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Vespucci</a><br></div><div dir="auto"><a href="https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/StreetComplete" rel="noopener noreferrer noreferrer noreferrer noreferrer noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/StreetComplete</a><br></div><div dir="auto"><a href="https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Osm_Go" rel="noopener noreferrer noreferrer noreferrer noreferrer noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Osm_Go</a>!<br></div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">iOS:<br></div><div dir="auto"><a href="https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Go_Map" rel="noopener noreferrer noreferrer noreferrer noreferrer noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Go_Map</a>!!<br></div><blockquote style="border-left:1px solid rgb(147,163,184);padding-left:10px;margin-left:5px"><div dir="auto"><div dir="auto">I think we need some way to make small areas of Africa available in a compressed format that can be unpacked on a smartphone with limited storage. We need software that is lightweight or can be side loaded to avoid overloading an internet connection and the software needs some basic functionality such as being able to add or edit tags on nodes or ways. It needs to be able to work offline and we need to get those changes home.<br></div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">I don't think the ability to draw in highways is essential but being able to paste a preset building outline might be nice.<br></div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">If possible it needs to display the local region and by local I mean say twenty kilometre square.<br></div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">Local language support would be nice.<br></div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">Thoughts on what is available or what could be built?<br></div></div></blockquote><div dir="auto">Vespucci fulfills your requirements from what I see.<br></div><div dir="auto">Not sure about OSM Go!<br></div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">StreetComplete has offline capability but not via file unpacked on a smartphone.<br></div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">Both Vespucci and StreetComplete have limitations - in short with Vespuuci<br></div><div dir="auto">people complain about too complex interface, with StreetComplete it<br></div><div dir="auto">is extremely limiting (detail can be added to existing objects, no mapping<br></div><div dir="auto">of new objects).<br></div> </div>
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