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</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body lang=EN-AU link=blue vlink=purple style='word-wrap:break-word'><div class=WordSection1><p class=MsoNormal><span style='mso-fareast-language:EN-US'>Hi Mateusz,<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='mso-fareast-language:EN-US'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='mso-fareast-language:EN-US'>I would not block any automated edit if it has popular backing. I just personally prefer manual edits that give me full control.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='mso-fareast-language:EN-US'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='mso-fareast-language:EN-US'>Given you are finding ‘tens of thousands’ of these issues are bots the best way or would it be better to concentrate on the editors and validators to ensure they don’t reoccur?<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='mso-fareast-language:EN-US'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='mso-fareast-language:EN-US'>Again, go ahead if there some consensus on specific tags. <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='mso-fareast-language:EN-US'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='mso-fareast-language:EN-US'>Many of the errors are from years ago and from one off mappers who may well have left the OSM project altogether<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='mso-fareast-language:EN-US'><a href="https://www.openstreetmap.org/user/jeandany/history#map=13/18.6626/-72.2393">https://www.openstreetmap.org/user/jeandany/history#map=13/18.6626/-72.2393</a><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='mso-fareast-language:EN-US'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='mso-fareast-language:EN-US'>Cheers - Phil<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='mso-fareast-language:EN-US'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='mso-fareast-language:EN-US'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div style='border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm'><p class=MsoNormal><b><span lang=EN-US>From:</span></b><span lang=EN-US> Mateusz Konieczny via talk <talk@openstreetmap.org> <br><b>Sent:</b> Thursday, 28 July 2022 4:23 PM<br><b>Cc:</b> 'OSM Talk' <talk@openstreetmap.org><br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [OSM-talk] Proposed bot edit: remove "surface=no data" and other useless surface values<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>Jul 28, 2022, 07:33 by <a href="mailto:phil@wyatt-family.com">phil@wyatt-family.com</a>:<o:p></o:p></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #93A3B8 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 8.0pt;margin-left:3.75pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='mso-fareast-language:EN-US'>Hi Mateusz,</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='mso-fareast-language:EN-US'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='mso-fareast-language:EN-US'>The bonus of a manual edit (or country based roulette challenge) is that you can also look for other no data or incorrect values at the same time</span><o:p></o:p></p></div></blockquote><div><p class=MsoNormal>I know.<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>But I have massive queue (in thousands and tens of<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>thousands) of automatically detectable issues which are not reported by<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>mainstream validators, require fixes and fix requires review or<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>complete manual cleanup.<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>And alternative here to a bot edit is a semi-manual or manual edit<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>which only adds drudgery.<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>So blocking that bot edit would not be resulting in more improvements<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>overall, it would just force me to do manually what should be a bot edit,<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>leaving less time for issues where human attention is more useful.<o:p></o:p></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #93A3B8 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 8.0pt;margin-left:3.75pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><o:p> </o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='mso-fareast-language:EN-US'> </span><o:p></o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='mso-fareast-language:EN-US'><a href="https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/189838973" target="_blank">https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/189838973</a></span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='mso-fareast-language:EN-US'><a href="https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/182945712#map=18/-7.55221/110.29252" target="_blank">https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/182945712#map=18/-7.55221/110.29252</a></span><o:p></o:p></p></div></blockquote><div><p class=MsoNormal>remaining problems would be detected by other filters (and looks like an effect<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>of a broken import)<o:p></o:p></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #93A3B8 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 8.0pt;margin-left:3.75pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='mso-fareast-language:EN-US'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='mso-fareast-language:EN-US'>How will you handle cases where they are the only tags on the objects?</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='mso-fareast-language:EN-US'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='mso-fareast-language:EN-US'><a href="https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/843512464" target="_blank">https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/843512464</a></span><o:p></o:p></p></div></blockquote><div><p class=MsoNormal>surface tag would be removed, what would reveal problem with this object<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>in standard QA tools<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>as I already have seen this object I deleted it<o:p></o:p></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #93A3B8 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 8.0pt;margin-left:3.75pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='mso-fareast-language:EN-US'>In this case it looks like width and length are actually listed but with incorrect tagging</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='mso-fareast-language:EN-US'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='mso-fareast-language:EN-US'><a href="https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/189838973" target="_blank">https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/189838973</a></span><o:p></o:p></p></div></blockquote><div><p class=MsoNormal>I do not plan to do anything with <span style='mso-fareast-language:EN-US'>width and length tags, and would not notice </span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='mso-fareast-language:EN-US'>this problem anyway</span><o:p></o:p></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #93A3B8 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 8.0pt;margin-left:3.75pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='mso-fareast-language:EN-US'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='mso-fareast-language:EN-US'>These are just a few that I had a quick look at</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='mso-fareast-language:EN-US'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style='mso-fareast-language:EN-US'>I know your specific interest is in smoothness but this shows the extent of collective bad tagging on objects that could be fixed on a single manual pass.</span><o:p></o:p></p></div></blockquote><div><p class=MsoNormal>I case of manual mapping I would fix it in separate edits anyway<o:p></o:p></p></div></div></body></html>