[Hot-francophone] [HOT] Tasking ManagerS (Was: {Re: Map4Haiti} + { Project over Grand'Anse})
Cristiano Giovando
cristiano.giovando at hotosm.org
Lun 24 Oct 22:42:30 UTC 2016
Salut Mohamet,
s'il vous plaît pardonnez mon ignorance de la langue française. Je
voudrais encore tendre la main à vous et tenter de communiquer sous
quelque forme que nous pouvons.
Google Translate peut pas très précis, donc je voudrais demander
gentiment Severin, Rod ou quelqu'un d'autre sur cette liste qui parle
anglais, pour faire plaisir à traduire (ou résumer) mon message.
Merci beaucoup!
Cristiano
On Mon, Oct 24, 2016 at 2:16 PM, mohamet lamine Ndiaye
<lamineyasey at gmail.com> wrote:
> Je peux juste que vous me dites si on est sur hot francophone ou pas.
> S'il vous plait parler en francais ou bien traduisez pour la majorite des
> personnes de cette liste on est pas oblige d'avoir recourt à Google
> translate puisqu'on est pas sur une liste anglaise
> Merci à vous
>
>
> Le 24 oct. 2016 5:35 PM, "Cristiano Giovando"
> <cristiano.giovando at hotosm.org> a écrit :
>>
>> Hi Severin,
>>
>> Thanks for your comment. The goal with project #2252 is indeed to map
>> all pre-event information, that is why I put the note to NOT map any
>> completely destroyed or uncertain feature/geometry.
>>
>> The destruction shown in that image is unfortunately very graphic, but
>> the fact that many trees have now collapsed, it allows to see features
>> like roads and streams that were previously hidden by vegetation.
>>
>> I have been looking for recent (2015-2016) pre-event imagery that
>> covers those areas (as that would be easier for baseline mapping) but
>> unfortunately haven't found any that is better registered and more
>> recent than Vintage/Bing (which in some areas is 2 to 4 years old).
>>
>> I also set the requirement for advanced image interpretation skills
>> and provided some visual examples in the project instructions tab. Let
>> me know if you guys see anything wrong in that approach and examples
>> or if you think it may be too challenging for volunteers (even more
>> experienced) to trace that imagery.
>>
>> Also, I mentioned that HOT will not be doing any damage assessment (in
>> terms of grading or mapping damage), so since ProjetEOF is already
>> engaged in that task through the UAV imagery, I thought you may want
>> to consider this imagery as well - and that's why I offered the TMS
>> endpoint.
>>
>> Cheers,
>>
>> Cristiano
>>
>>
>> On Mon, Oct 24, 2016 at 6:46 AM, Severin Menard
>> <severin.menard at gmail.com> wrote:
>> > Hi,
>> >
>> > We should first consolidate pre-disaster data (through Bing + vintage
>> > Digital Globe Imagery) before processing post-disaster data, so IMHO the
>> > two
>> > jobs are complementary.
>> >
>> > Sincerely,
>> >
>> > Severin
>> >
>> > On Mon, Oct 24, 2016 at 7:19 AM, Rod Bera <rod at goarem.org> wrote:
>> >>
>> >> now we've got overlapping tasks.
>> >>
>> >> http://taches.francophonelibre.org/project/64
>> >> http://tasks.hotosm.org/project/2252
>> >>
>> >> where do we go from here?
>> >>
>> >> This could/should have been anticipated/prevented.
>> >>
>> >> Now we should consider trans-TM indexing, as these and other TM
>> >> instances are probably here to last.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> On 24/10/16 10:07, Cristiano Giovando wrote:
>> >> > Bonjour,
>> >> >
>> >> > (s'il vous plaît excuser mon anglais)
>> >> >
>> >> > There are three WorldView 3 images available, captured on October 10
>> >> > over the Grand'Anse and Sud departments. These have limited cloud
>> >> > coverage and show very dramatically the impact of Hurricane Matthew
>> >> > in
>> >> > western Haiti:
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> https://beta.openaerialmap.org/#/-74.3994140625,18.521278249360137,10/032210312003?date=month&_k=uvs9ut
>> >> >
>> >> > We, at HOT would like to create three tasks to update all baseline
>> >> > information as shown by those images. I noticed that you guys
>> >> > currently have a task over the same area which is using Bing as
>> >> > default imagery source:
>> >> >
>> >> > http://taches.francophonelibre.org/project/64
>> >> >
>> >> > In order to coordinate our efforts, I would like you to consider this
>> >> > project that I just set up and ask you to let me know if you think it
>> >> > would make sense to publish it first, since it has that more recent
>> >> > imagery:
>> >> >
>> >> > http://tasks.hotosm.org/project/2252
>> >> >
>> >> > Right now it's published with low priority, just for you to be able
>> >> > to
>> >> > see it. For reference, this is the exact extent:
>> >> >
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> http://geojson.io/#id=gist:anonymous/5cfec955932472ebd1d23a01421a42c5&map=11/18.4698/-74.4193
>> >> >
>> >> > Please let me know what you think, also in terms of instructions.
>> >> > Happy to discuss or change anything based on everyone's feedback
>> >> > before publishing it (bumping it up to high priority).
>> >> >
>> >> > Also, we will not be doing any damage assessment (as indicated in the
>> >> > task), so if you guys have any need to do it, feel free to use the
>> >> > TMS
>> >> > services off of OAM. Here's one to browse the same October 10 image:
>> >> >
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> http://oam-dynamic-tiler-tmp.s3-website-us-east-1.amazonaws.com/57fecc6984ae75bb00ec752c/preview/#19/18.57497/-74.38157
>> >> >
>> >> > Looking forward to your feedback.
>> >> > Thank you,
>> >> >
>> >> > Cristiano
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> On 24/10/16 11:46, Rod Bera wrote:
>> >> > Hi Mikel,
>> >> >
>> >> >> that's a seperate topic from running an additional unnecessary
>> >> >> tasking manager.
>> >> >
>> >> > to me it's not.
>> >> > As I understand things, the fact that a task needs to be
>> >> > endorsed/supported by HOT if it is to appear on tasks.hotosm.org is a
>> >> > problem. The fact that only co-opted ("trained", "friends")
>> >> > individual
>> >> > can post a task is a problem too.
>> >> >
>> >> > There were discussions on this in the past with people advocating a
>> >> > more
>> >> > open policy for tasks.hotosm.org.
>> >> >
>> >> > This did not happen for some reasons internal to HOT US Inc.
>> >> >
>> >> > Then it appeared as a logical consequence that others would set-up
>> >> > tasking managers fit for their needs.
>> >> > Related to this is last year's discussion on default logos (TM by
>> >> > default had a HOT logo), name (HOT tasking manager formerly
>> >> > incorrectly
>> >> > known as OSM tasking manager). This was settled, more or less.
>> >> >
>> >> > The next logical step (I also mentioned it at that time) was what is
>> >> > happening now: possibly conflicting tasks. Well it is not the case
>> >> > yet:
>> >> > as as far as I can see there is no overlap between tasks from
>> >> > tasks.hotosm.org and tasks from taches.francophonelibre.org, but it
>> >> > will
>> >> > fatally happen at some point.
>> >> >
>> >> > To address this I proposed a number of solutions which had not much
>> >> > success:
>> >> > -indexing tasking managers and tasks into a reference catalogue, or
>> >> > -indexing TMs and tasks into catalogueS, possibly one for each TM
>> >> > with
>> >> > service metadata, and subsequently allow for either cross-harvesting,
>> >> > or
>> >> > -bottom-up harvesting if there is a truly community-operated
>> >> > reference
>> >> > catalogue endorsed by everyone.
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > I agree this makes things a bit complicated as it would ideally
>> >> > require
>> >> > GeoNetwork instances (ideally one for each TM) or something similar.
>> >> > But
>> >> > the INSPIRE SDI experience in Europe shows it works quite smoothly.
>> >> >
>> >> > However I agree it adds-up some complexity where we could avoid it.
>> >> > If
>> >> > only there was only ONE TM that would be EVERYONE'S TM.
>> >> > The de facto control of the original TM by HOT with a disputable
>> >> > policy
>> >> > as to who had a right/privilege to define and post tasks broke up
>> >> > this
>> >> > hope.
>> >> >
>> >> > Given this I have no problem with tasks.hotosm.org being administered
>> >> > with HOT US Inc. rules. Or other TM being administered according to
>> >> > different policies. We are diverse after all.
>> >> >
>> >> > Now, we probably agree that beyond this diversity we have to work
>> >> > together as a global community.
>> >> >
>> >> > To this aim I'll be happy to collaborate with you to find ways of
>> >> > coming
>> >> > up with the kind of "universal catalogue of tasks" we (OSM) need.
>> >> >
>> >> > tasks.hotosm.org #2219 #2229 #2236 #2237 #2248 etc., as well as
>> >> > taches.francophonelibre.org #35 #40 # 41 #45 #63 #64 #65 #66 #67 etc.
>> >> > are all pertinent and they all should be primarily viewed as the
>> >> > contributions from the OSM community instead of the organisations
>> >> > running the tasking managers.
>> >> >
>> >> > Regards,
>> >> >
>> >> > Rod
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > On 15/10/16 15:28, Mikel Maron wrote:
>> >> >> Agree with you John. Working with local mapper groups of course is
>> >> >> the
>> >> >> best. There are many French speaking HOT members and volunteers,
>> >> >> including in Haiti.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> But that's a seperate topic from running an additional unnecessary
>> >> >> tasking manager.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Mikel
>> >> >>
>> >> >> On Saturday, October 15, 2016, 9:08 AM, john whelan
>> >> >> <jwhelan0112 at gmail.com> wrote:
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Which begs the question why should HOT decide the priorities?
>> >> >>
>> >> >> I note that we don't see many projects from local groups
>> >> >> especially
>> >> >> in the high priority list and in this case Haiti the local
>> >> >> language
>> >> >> is French which means it is more difficult for the local needs
>> >> >> to
>> >> >> be
>> >> >> understood by none francophone outsiders.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> There are problems with the functioning of the government of
>> >> >> Haiti
>> >> >> but there are functioning OSM locals but the best way to
>> >> >> strengthen
>> >> >> them is to work with them.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Cheerio John
>> >> >>
>> >> >> On 15 October 2016 at 08:03, Mikel Maron <mikel.maron at gmail.com
>> >> >> <javascript:return>> wrote:
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Having two tasking managers for the same response area is of
>> >> >> course going to create conflicts. There's no need at all to
>> >> >> create jobs for Haiti on another tasking manager. Simply,
>> >> >> communicate the needs for mapping, including AOI, need, etc,
>> >> >> to
>> >> >> the HOT activation team and it will be prioritized and set
>> >> >> up.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Mikel
>> >> >>
>> >> >> On Saturday, October 15, 2016, 4:51 AM, Severin Menard
>> >> >> <severin.menard at gmail.com <javascript:return>> wrote:
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Hi,
>> >> >>
>> >> >> New update about our contribution to the OSM Map4Haiti
>> >> >> mapping. Job #45
>> >> >> <http://taches.francophonelibre.org/project/45#task/61>
>> >> >> is
>> >> >> almost done now and we will start mapping the rural
>> >> >> areas
>> >> >> within the hills of département of Grande-Anse, over the
>> >> >> communes of Abricots, Dame-Marie, Chambellan, Moron,
>> >> >> Anse
>> >> >> d'Hainault and Grande Anse, located in the most affected
>> >> >> areas by Hurricane Matthew (UNOSAT impact zone 1, with
>> >> >> winds
>> >> >> over 120 km/h) with job #64
>> >> >> <http://taches.francophonelibre.org/project/64>,
>> >> >> continuing
>> >> >> our systematic, consolidated effort over the hills
>> >> >> (called
>> >> >> mornes in Haiti).
>> >> >>
>> >> >> We hold an agile SOTM today here at Université Alassane
>> >> >> Ouattara and will have a team of crisis mapping during
>> >> >> the
>> >> >> whole day to show students and people what it is. No
>> >> >> newcomer will be invited to map on Haiti from Bouaké but
>> >> >> invited to become a local mapper, raise his skills and
>> >> >> join
>> >> >> later when experienced enough.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> I hope this message is read by the HOT US coordination
>> >> >> team,
>> >> >> especially Dale Kunce:
>> >> >>
>> >> >> October 8 6:30 PM UTC I communicated about job #39
>> >> >> <http://taches.francophonelibre.org/project/39> about
>> >> >> pre-disaster mapping over Jeremie. On October 12, when
>> >> >> our
>> >> >> mapping is almost done on Central Jeremie, we figure out
>> >> >> people are mapping on the area, due to a HOT US job
>> >> >> #2228
>> >> >> <http://tasks.hotosm.org/project/2228> created by Dale
>> >> >> Kunce. We stopped and quickly detected all the mistakes
>> >> >> done
>> >> >> by very recent mappers.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> October 12 11:40 AM UTC I communicated on the hot list
>> >> >> including regarding job #45
>> >> >> <http://taches.francophonelibre.org/project/45> about
>> >> >> mapping Jeremie’s hinterland. Later this day, HOT US job
>> >> >> #2224 <http://tasks.hotosm.org/project/2224> covering an
>> >> >> area slightly smaller inside the one I made was created
>> >> >> by
>> >> >> Dale Kunce... As if there was no other places to be
>> >> >> mapped
>> >> >> in Haiti...
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >> So far, we created 7 jobs over Haiti, I communicated
>> >> >> about
>> >> >> them and they are all on the
>> >> >> <http://taches.francophonelibre.org>http://taches.
>> >> >> francophonelibre.org frontpage, so it is not a big deal
>> >> >> just
>> >> >> to check them.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> @Dale I think HOT US created a curriculum to raise
>> >> >> skills
>> >> >> to
>> >> >> become Crisis activators, I would advise you to read it
>> >> >> one
>> >> >> day when you have a bit of time. If ever it does not
>> >> >> mention
>> >> >> to read and communicate in the hot list during an
>> >> >> activation, I would suggest to add it into the
>> >> >> documentation. As an incorporated company, HOT US may
>> >> >> have
>> >> >> its own internal tools to organize its mapping, but the
>> >> >> minimum is to communicate a bit on the hot list with the
>> >> >> OSM
>> >> >> community, who is the holder of this list (as everything
>> >> >> with @openstreetmap.org <http://openstreetmap.org>).
>> >> >>
>> >> >> If you now create a new job covering job #45
>> >> >> <http://taches.francophonelibre.org/project/45#task/61>,
>> >> >> I
>> >> >> may try next time to create a job in the middle of the
>> >> >> water, just to see if you jump on it.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Sincerely,
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Severin
>> >> >>
>> >> >> ______________________________ _________________
>> >> >> HOT mailing list
>> >> >> HOT at openstreetmap.org
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >> <https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/hot>https://lists.openstreetmap.
>> >> >> org/listinfo/hot
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >> ______________________________ _________________
>> >> >> HOT mailing list
>> >> >> HOT at openstreetmap.org <javascript:return>
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >> <https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/hot>https://lists.openstreetmap.
>> >> >> org/listinfo/hot
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >> _______________________________________________
>> >> >> HOT mailing list
>> >> >> HOT at openstreetmap.org
>> >> >> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/hot
>> >> >>
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> --
>> >> Rod Béra, MCF Géomatique / Lecturer, Geomatics
>> >> et SIG pour l'Environnement / and Environmental GIS
>> >> Agrocampus-Ouest|65 r.Saint-Brieuc|CS84215|35042 Rennes cedex|France
>> >> +33 (0) 223 48 5553 - roderic.bera at agrocampus-ouest.fr
>> >>
>> >> _______________________________________________
>> >> HOT mailing list
>> >> HOT at openstreetmap.org
>> >> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/hot
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > HOT mailing list
>> > HOT at openstreetmap.org
>> > https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/hot
>> >
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Cristiano Giovando
>> Humanitarian OpenStreetMap Team
>> cristiano.giovando at hotosm.org
>> http://www.hotosm.org
>>
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--
Cristiano Giovando
Humanitarian OpenStreetMap Team
cristiano.giovando at hotosm.org
http://www.hotosm.org
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