[HOT] Gentle grump

Daniel Joseph dan.b.joseph at gmail.com
Fri Mar 6 22:36:23 UTC 2015

Hey Ray,

Some shortcuts for JOSM are here

The learning materials for OSM are constantly being developed and improved.
MapGive created some nice intro materials
http://mapgive.state.gov/learn-to-map/. HOT is still actively working on
learnosm (http://learnosm.org/en/). HOT has also just started to develop
OSM tracing guides (http://hotosm.github.io/tracing-guides/). Both of the
HOT projects are GitHub repositories (https://github.com/hotosm/learnosm
and https://github.com/hotosm/tracing-guides). Contributors welcome! You
don't need to write tutorials, it's helpful if you even just submit issues
via Github to request materials or point out deficiencies/mistakes. If you
don't have/want a Github account, notify the list and I'm sure someone can
log the issue for you.

All the best,
Dan Joseph

On Fri, Mar 6, 2015 at 3:07 PM, Ray Kiddy <ray at ganymede.org> wrote:

> On Tue, 3 Mar 2015 15:12:21 -0500
> john whelan <jwhelan0112 at gmail.com> wrote:
> > Just for the heck of it I ran JOSM validation on a tile I was mapping
> > before touching it.  It turned up duplicate buildings, crossed
> > buildings, lots of highways separated by a few inches etc.
> >
> > Do we need an idiot guide?  A sort of this is how to provide the
> > maximum benefit for the least effort.
> Speaking as an idiot, I would say that the answer to this is yes.
> Perhaps you think I jest....
> > Mine would probably run along the lines of for Africa the convention
> > is only the following values of highways are used for minor highways:
> > path, track, unclassified, use highway=road if you are uncertain.
> > Someone will probably have tagged the secondary and primary highways.
> >  <http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:highway%3Dsecondary>
> > If possible use JOSM especially for buildings.  Please map buildings
> > as building=yes do not assume it is a house.
> As a 2-3 times per week mapper (who wishes I could do more), it can get
> frustrating. Lots of projects point to the Africa roads page but that
> page is hard to interpret for any particular context. There is a lot of
> information.
> And I hate to say it but I use ID and it drives me nuts. This may be
> from browser/js/platform issues. I am using Firefox 36.0 on Ubuntu
> 14.04 LTS. But I have looked at JOSM and it is somewhat bewildering and
> I have no idea how long it would take to get over the first humps of the
> learning curve. For now, my annoyances with ID are tolerable.
> If one was able to look at a task and see what tags where being used
> and how often within just that task, this might help the "African
> roads" situation.
> > People use maps to get from one place to another, if the highways are
> > joined up then routing software such as comes as part of OSMAND can be
> > used.   Look for highways around settlements that connect to other
> > settlements.
> >
> > <Crtl><arrow> in JOSM will navigate vertically or horizontally making
> > scanning easier.
> I should see if there is a cheat sheet for JOSM. It would be nice to
> know what control-shift-elbox-J does and all that. Of course, these may
> be platform specific (eg Windows keys vs Linux keys vs MacOS X keys).
> > I assume that most of these errors have crept in because JOSM
> > validation was not used.  I suspect that the immediate feedback from
> > JOSM might assist our less skilled mappers to improve their skills.
> >
> > Cheerio John
> There needs to be validation on input and obviously both ID and JOSM do
> some, but can validation be done on the server? This would be better,
> especially if the results can be communicated to users. A HOT task could
> have a "Validations" tab. I, for one, would like to see the things that
> have been already fixed in data in that task. It would let me know when
> there are things not to do. If I am going to make a mistake within a
> task's maps, it is at least a bit likely that others will make or
> have made similar mistakes in the same context.
> Again, seeing the phrase "JOSM might assist our less skilled mappers",
> I have to wonder what you are thinking about here. Any sentence with
> both "JOSM" and "less skilled mappers" in it is going to lead to bad
> things. JOSM might be easier than it is, but I am not even very sure of
> that. Sometimes complex tasks require complex tools. One just hopes
> that there are options between the "very-simple-but-also-brain-dead"
> tool and the "amazingly-powerful-but-shockingly-unintuitive" tool. I am
> not saying that this is what JSOM and ID are, but hopefully you see my
> point.
> So, grump back at ya. :-)
> cheers - ray
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