[HOT] Mapping buildings with new mappers at a maperthon
hnugter
hnugter at nugter.nl
Mon Nov 20 13:44:31 UTC 2017
Dear Everybody,
I'm one of the new mappers and a read alle these mails with great interest.
I just started to map 6 months ago because of an article in our local
paper. First I started to map with ID, very easy to use but recently I
learned myself to work with JOSM and the building plugin.
My problems are somewhat differen from what I read in the discussions,
When I finish mapping I often ask for comment but during the last six
months I recieved only once a comment on my work. I think that new
mappers would love to get feedback as soon as possible. One other thing
is when I start with a new task, sometimes a lot of work is already done
but also sometimes very poorly, buildings not squared or misplaced. I
wonder, should I correct that or leave it for the validators?
An other thing is that everything on the map is out of place, buildings,
roads etc. Probebly the previous mapper has used an other image than
described in the instructions where it is written to use Bing, again
should I correct that or is there an other way to continue with that task?
I'm a beginner with JOSM but for me it's easyer to work with than ID.
And than finaly, it seems there is not much to do now for beginners,
Best regards
Henk Nugter
Op 20-11-2017 om 14:05 schreef Bjoern Hassler:
> Dear friends,
>
> thanks for the replies and engaging discussion. Can I propose that we
> start a google document to put down some of the ideas, and perhaps
> organise a follow-up chat or community seminar where the ideas can be
> discussed further? Outcomes can then be added to
> http://learnosm.org/en/coordination/mapathon/
> <http://learnosm.org/en/coordination/mapathon/> ?
>
> I'll send you all invites to the document off list. I'll leave the
> document so that no sign-in is required, in case you don't want to
> have a google account!
> Bjoern
>
> On 20 November 2017 at 12:53, john whelan <jwhelan0112 at gmail.com
> <mailto:jwhelan0112 at gmail.com>> wrote:
>
> The interesting thing is when the very experienced iD specialist
> mapped a building they did it by placing a dot in the four corners
> of the building then the ways and tag were added very quickly by a
> short cut perhaps?
>
> By placing the four corners first you could see clearly where they
> should go. I don't know how it was done but as an interim measure
> perhaps we could teach this method of mapping buildings?
>
> Cheerio John
>
> On 20 November 2017 at 07:36, Stuart Ward <stuart.ward at bcs.org
> <mailto:stuart.ward at bcs.org>> wrote:
>
> Having spent considerable time fixing iD editor squares
> non-square buildings, with random shared nodes, connected to
> roads, and areas, getting a better first time result is so
> important.
>
> I pains where you come across a square that they have clearly
> spent quite a lot of time mapping all the ins and outs of
> buildings.
>
> Stuart
>
> --
> Stuart Ward M +44 7782325143 <tel:+44%207782%20325143>
>
> On 19 November 2017 at 15:52, Blake Girardot HOT/OSM
> <blake.girardot at hotosm.org <mailto:blake.girardot at hotosm.org>>
> wrote:
>
> Hi,
>
> A lot of this would be addressed if iD had a building
> mapping tool
> like JOSM does. I am going to restart the effort to get
> that added in
> to iD, I have some new ideas for how we might be able to
> accomplish
> it. I think it would save literally hundreds of hours
> volunteer time
> fixing buildings that are mapped by new mappers and help
> new mappers
> increase their productivity and accuracy.
>
> iD is by far the more approachable editor for OSM, it runs
> on any
> desktop or laptop with zero installation issues and has a
> great
> built-in tutorial, so I think we would be well served by
> helping
> improve iD.
>
> If there are any JS wizards out there who want to help
> complete the
> building tool for iD (it is already started, just not
> completed)
> please contact me directly :)
>
> Cheers,
> Blake
>
>
>
> On Sun, Nov 19, 2017 at 3:40 PM, john whelan
> <jwhelan0112 at gmail.com <mailto:jwhelan0112 at gmail.com>> wrote:
> > and I totally concur with what Ralph has said.
> >
> > We asked people who were attending to install JAVA
> before they arrived and I
> > had josm-tested.jar available on a DVD to minimise the
> stress on the wifi
> > network. I had a USB DVD device with me and a bag of
> mice. The particular
> > maperthon I was at was a one off affair but we had
> someone from the local
> > OSM group mention how to find the monthly meetings where
> mapping took place.
> >
> > Note I had two machines available that had JAVA, JOSM
> with the plugins
> > already installed so it was just a matter of "come in,
> sit down, create an
> > account, wiggle the mouse now you've mapped your first
> building." Upload,
> > then we got them to install JOSM on their own machine
> and when we downloaded
> > the tile again their previous mapping was there which
> reinforced the idea
> > that they were mapping on a live database.
> >
> > It could be just me but my feeling was we got a bit more
> engagement with
> > JOSM as they could see the underlying tags and having
> shown one mapper how
> > to join up two rectangles for an L shaped building I
> asked them to show
> > another mapper how to do it when they wanted to know
> which helps on the
> > confidence building side.
> >
> > For highways there is less to choose between the two
> editors but for
> > buildings certainly for accuracy currently JOSM and the
> building_tool plugin
> > wins hands down.
> >
> > I think the large maperthons have their place but
> perhaps we need more
> > mini-maperthons?
> >
> > Cheerio John
> >
> > On 19 November 2017 at 03:07, <ralph.aytoun at ntlworld.com
> <mailto:ralph.aytoun at ntlworld.com>> wrote:
> >>
> >> A useful guide to running your Mapathon can be found here
> >> http://learnosm.org/en/coordination/mapathon/
> <http://learnosm.org/en/coordination/mapathon/>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> There is no hard and fast rule to running a successful
> Mapathon. As I
> >> point out, each Mapathon will evolve at it’s own pace
> and in it’s own
> >> direction dependent the expertise of the people
> organizing and leading, on
> >> the people attending, the facilities available and the
> number of people
> >> involved.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> As to the choice of Editor used, I agree with John that
> JOSM is preferred,
> >> unfortunately that choice is not always available. We
> have found that
> >> dealing with new mappers using school or corporate
> computers/laptops it is
> >> not always permitted to download other programmes, or
> if you have a large
> >> group uploading/downloading at the same time can cause
> problems for the
> >> available WiFi, and with one really large group we
> overloaded the OSM
> >> server. So our choice is to start the large group of
> new mappers with iD
> >> Editor so that we can get them mapping as quickly as we
> can and then deal
> >> with any questions they have during the session.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> I do not count any success on how many squares have
> been completed
> >> although it is encouraging to the group to be shown at
> the end how much
> >> their contribution has advanced the project they are
> working on. I prefer to
> >> concentrate on getting the mappers to a stage where
> they are comfortable
> >> with their mapping and confident enough to try mapping
> further on their own
> >> at home and hopefully interested enough to return for
> further guidance.
> >> Going around the room and looking at what they are
> doing is paramount to
> >> this success. Telling them that they have got it and
> their work is good
> >> gives them the assurance they need to continue and even
> become more
> >> adventurous, so John is correct in saying that the
> one-to-one does show more
> >> promise and achieve better mapping. Even stopping to
> show a new mapper how
> >> to improve and correct their work has a very positive
> effect on their
> >> confidence.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Working with small groups definitely is an advantage
> because of the
> >> personal attention they can get, but will be more
> effective it you can get
> >> them meeting on a regular basis to build on their
> experience and skill with
> >> the various tools on JOSM.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> At the London monthly Mapathon we have three training
> sections running at
> >> the same time … iD , JOSM and Validating. And it is up
> to the individual as
> >> to which session they sign up to. If they want to start
> straight away with
> >> JOSM they are welcome to do so. The mappers know that
> there is going to be a
> >> Mapathon on the first Tuesday of every month so it
> becomes a fixed date on
> >> their calendar which does help with returning mappers.
> We also keep the
> >> email addresses of attendees and they will get invited
> back to future
> >> Mapathons with an Eventbrite invitation.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> As a guide to success I would point you to the fact
> that most of the
> >> trainers at the London Mapathons started off as
> newcomers and have stayed
> >> and progressed, a number of attendees have gone on to
> start up mapping
> >> groups at their universities. Also at universities and
> corporate offices
> >> where we have run Mapathons they have started up
> inhouse Mapping Parties and
> >> Mapathons of their own.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Martin Dittus gave us some statistics early on in the
> process of evolving
> >> the London Mapathons which showed approximately 30%
> return rate but it
> >> tailed of quickly, which is why we decided to offer the
> returning mappers
> >> the option of going onto JOSM, this helped the
> retention of mappers and now
> >> we also have a MidMonth Mapathon for experienced JOSM
> mappers to get
> >> involved in more advanced work.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> To sum up, yes JOSM is desirable in getting good
> building mapping and very
> >> definitely when the mapping moves into dense city
> centres or slums where
> >> they are built butting up against each other. But then
> for people with no
> >> previous map experience the learning curve is very
> steep, having to learn
> >> about OSM, the Tasking Manager, the Editor, read
> Satellite Imagery, drawing
> >> the features and also tagging correctly so reducing
> this slightly by using
> >> the iD Editor to start with does make sense when you
> have a limited time to
> >> get them started.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> If you have any questions regarding getting started or
> running your
> >> Mapathon feel free to email me and I will try to help
> where I can.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Hope some of this might be useful.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Regards
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Ralph
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Sent from Mail for Windows 10
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
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> >
> >
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>
>
> --
> ----------------------------------------------------
> Blake Girardot
> Humanitarian OpenStreetMap Team
>
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