[Imports] [Talk-cz] CzechAddress Import

[Petr Vejsada]

Dne St 12. března 2014 21:31:38, Martin Koppenhoefer napsal(a):

> This means you can add the name of the administrative district, but you do
> not have to, it still remains a valid and unambiguous address. IMHO you
> shouldn't tag this district to every housenumber. "Vinohrady" is redundant
> information in this case and not necessary for the location to be found. Or
> are there maybe also other "130 00 Praha 3 - xy" where xy is not
> "Vinohrady"? Also for Boleslavska?

Aaaah, we are back again in the discussion about addr:place. It's 
neverending...

You're right, in _this_ case, address without Vinohrady is valid. But:

- people knows, i'm living in Vinohrady. They usually don't know, i'm living 
in Praha 3

- Nominatim really cann't find the house without tag addr:place. "Libochovany 
129" or "Vinohrady 1989" - nothing found. It was my primary motivation to run 
this import - posibility to find what i'm searching for.

- cadastral place Vinohrady and "cast obce" Vinohrady (piece of city or so) is 
NOT the same. In most cases it's very simillar, but not the same. addr:place 
(cast obce) has no boundaries defined. addr:place is defined as list of 
addresses, no boundaries, no boundaries in OSM, no boundaries in RUIAN, 
because those boundaries don't exists. Everywhere in this discussion i wrote 
"(cadastral) place", not "cadastral place". I tried to simplify it hoping i 
don't need to explain all details, but i probably have to do it.

Yes - there is:

Praha 3 - Vinohrady
Praha 3 - Zizkov
Praha 3 - Strasnice
Praha 3 - Vysocany

also

Praha 10 - Strasnice
Praha 9 - Vysocany
etc.

Yes again - one street can lay in more then one mestska cast or cadastral 
place or cast obce. For example one long street, Sokolovska in Prague:

http://mapapi.poloha.net/search?query=50.09156%2C14.44033
Sokolovska, 186 00  Praha 8 - Karlin

http://mapapi.poloha.net/search?query=50.10091%2C14.47278
Sokolovska, 180 00, Praha 8 - Liben

http://mapapi.poloha.net/search?query=50.10690%2C14.48921
Sokolovska, 190 00, Praha 9 - Liben

http://mapapi.poloha.net/search?query=50.11053%2C14.50056
Sokolovska, 182 00, Praha 9 - Vysocany

> 
> You could also in other countries add superfluous administrative (or even
> geographic) entities at various levels which are not needed for the address
> but do not harm neither as long as they are correct, but we generally don't
> add these to the address tags in OSM, e.g. I could add after Rome and Italy
> also Europe to the address on a letter. Should I add addr:continent=Europe
> to every housenumber? I think not.

No, of course, Europe is not needed, i planned to add tag planet=earth, but 
only minority of my friends live on Mars ;-), so i gave it up ;-))

Dne St 12. března 2014 16:54:07, Serge Wroclawski napsal(a):

> There is an enormous amount of redundancy in this information, since
> the districts/sections of the city are polygons, it would make more
> sense to add them as polygons and then be done with it.

There is some redundancy, but i don't think enormous ...

There is polygon of country boundaries - addr:country=CZ is redundant. We 
explained several times, why to use this tag Yes, it's about geocoders. It's a 
part of address.

There are polygons of city boundaries - addr:city=* is redundant. City is part 
of address.

There are NO polygons of "cast obce", inexistant boundaries we can't import 
into OSM - addr:place=* is not redundant. addr:place is not cadastral place. 
addr:place is nececessary part of address, if there is no 
addr:suburb/borough/...

addr:street - there are linestrings of streets, Can geocoders look at the 
nearest street? I think, this doesn't need discussion.

addr:postcode - no polygons, not redundant

addr:suburb/borough - no polygons in OSM. Those polygons exists and can be 
imported, but for some reasons operator of the czechreg bot decided not to 
import them. 

> The argument that the Czech folks have responded with is that it's
> easier to parse a full address than not, but this is a job that
> geocoders do all the time.

This is hardly reached compromis based on wide discussion in talk-cz. Everyone 
has theirs own truth.

> For example, if there is a restaurant POI in New York City, I don't
> need to add addr:city, addr:state and addr:country - it is obvious
> based on the location.

Agree, it's a little bit diferent. This is amenity point, not address point. 
Restaurant is in house (sometimes, garden restaurant is not) and the house 
usually has their's own address point.

> I don't even need to mention what borough (or county) the object is in
> for the same reasons.

> Adding in the other fields is just a matter for a geocoder.

As i said - this is hardly reached compromis.

--
Petr