[Imports] Bad imports

[Jo]

I would say that even though they quack almost exactly the same, they are
still different kinds of ducks. The best way to proceed is to create a
specific tag for them and you can even ask to have it rendered almost
exactly the same as the official living streets.

Polyglot

2016-01-26 16:15 GMT+01:00 Jaakko Helleranta <jaakko at helleranta.com>:

> Just a brief comment on using living_street in contexts where the road is
> not legally defined as a living street.
>
> I was facing a similar situation first in Haiti 3-4 years ago (where I
> lived and mapped extensively in close collaboration with local mappers for
> three years) and then in Nicaragua where same has happened for over two
> years now.
>
> I think that the situation is quite simple:
> The characteristics of various roads are very clearly in line with the
> characteristics that define a legal living street, namely where there is a
> lot of non-vehicular activity both _on_ the road and on its both sides AND
> where pedestrians have undeniable right of way over vehicles. In Haiti I
> was saying, "If you'd drive these roads not giving way to pedestrians your
> car would be stoned."
>
> Since I started to ponder about the appropriate tagging of these roads
> I've learned that the living_street tag is used quite broadly / extensively
> in various countries with similar settings as Haiti and Nicaragua (and
> where there often is no such thing as a legally defined living street).
>
> In summary, I think it would be a bit ignorant or/and foolish for those
> without understanding of the on-the-ground realities of these countries to
> claim that living_street is an inappropriate tag. At least until there is a
> "unofficial_living_street" tag to replace it. Regular residential roads
> these are not.
>
> I have a pile of street view pictures from both Haiti and Nicaragua to
> help understand the situation on the ground if someone wants to look into
> this on a practical level. You can start by downloading all living streets
> in Managua, Nicaragua to JOSM and looking at the photos available in
> Mapillary for these roads.
>
> With best regards from Managua,
> -Jaakko
>
> --
> Sent from my mobile device.
> On Jan 24, 2016 7:44 PM, "Mikel Maron" <mikel_maron at yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>> Hi
>>
>> Thanks for investigating the data issues Sander. As I did when you
>> contacted me last week, I'll explain the issues here as I see them, and
>> discuss some simple ways I'll see to getting them fixed.
>>
>> On the "Bad Imports" page, this new process is unnecessary. There is
>> already a substantial process for managing imports and resolving data
>> issues, documented in the wiki and managed by the DWG.
>>
>> On the data in Enugu, my role in the original import was to advise
>> colleagues involved directly in the data collection and import, and then to
>> make some repairs to the roads (that is why I appear as the first editor of
>> many features). There are two issues.
>>
>> One is "living_street". My understanding is that they used
>> "living_street" in cases of unpaved residential roads, because there is a
>> great amount of activity directly on these roads, and "resembled" living
>> streets in the EU. There is no legal definition of living street in
>> Nigeria. At the time of the import, I didn't totally agree with the
>> classification, but didn't think it that important. Given the question on
>> classification now, I think it's best to improve this, and will do so, by
>> changing classification to residential road.
>>
>> Second, there are a good number of tags on POI that should not have been
>> included in a related import of Enugu (for example
>> http://www.openstreetmap.org/node/2460130808/history). The simple
>> solution here is to identify those tags, and remove them, and I will see to
>> this as well.
>>
>> -Mikel
>>
>> * Mikel Maron * +14152835207 @mikel s:mikelmaron
>>
>>
>> On Sunday, January 24, 2016 6:23 PM, Daniel O'Connor <
>> daniel.oconnor at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>> Re Enugu, see
>> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/imports/2013-August/002112.html
>> for some of the discussion around this data.
>>
>> Mikel Maron (http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/User:Mikel) is the chap
>> with the main user account for the roads data.
>>
>> On Mon, Jan 25, 2016 at 3:04 AM, Sander Deryckere <sanderd17 at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>> Meanwhile I contacted some users and documented the contacts in the wiki.
>>
>> If anyone finds other harmful imports, or has an opinion on the mentioned
>> imports, please add them to the wiki.
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Sander
>>
>>
>> 2016-01-24 15:53 GMT+01:00 Sander Deryckere <sanderd17 at gmail.com>:
>>
>> I recently discovered a number of bad imports, but found out it's hard to
>> discuss those, and keep track of those discussions, as there's no central
>> platform where that could happen.
>>
>> There are f.e. changeset discussions, but when the importer doesn't
>> answer, you don't get notified anymore, and nobody else will keep an eye on
>> it.
>>
>> So I started a wiki page to gather information about bad imports,
>> together with an initial procedure to handle those (giving some times to
>> allow discussion and cleanups).
>>
>> see https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Bad_imports
>>
>> I already documented some bad imports there, but not yet who I contacted
>> (though I contacted two importers via changeset messages, and that will be
>> hard to find back if they don't react).
>>
>> If any of you find bad imports, I should ask you to also add them to the
>> list, and regularly keep an eye on the list. When that list gets used more
>> often, we won't lose track of those discussions anymore.
>>
>> If you have any remarks on the procedure, feel free to raise concerns.
>> But I like some hard dates as else people wonder whether it would be ok to
>> revert it already or not. And I think the current terms are reasonable.
>>
>> Regards,
>> Sander
>>
>>
>>
>>
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