[Imports] Calgary addresses

Brian May bmay at mapwise.com
Tue Jul 19 14:39:40 UTC 2016

Don't Alberta statutes define what any government operating within 
Alberta can and can't do with public records?

For example, the statutes should define whether the City of Calgary can 
add additional conditions of release of public records such as an 
indemnification clause or the "unlawful purposes" clause.

List of public records laws websites in Canada:

Alberta's Freedom of Information and Protection of Privacy Act

Search on "unlawful" in the doc:
Disclosure harmful to law enforcement
20(1) The head of a public body may refuse to disclose
information to an applicant if the disclosure could reasonably be
expected to
(k) facilitate the commission of an unlawful act or hamper the
control of crime,

Search on "indemnification" and "indemnify" in the doc:
no results

On the unlawful part, doesn't seem to me that OSM "reasonably expects 
users of OSM to (k) facilitate the commission of an unlawful act or 
hamper the control of crime". Why would the city release the addresses 
at all if the city "reasonably expects..."

On the in indemnification part, I'm not sure which way that goes. For 
example, if its not addressed in the statute, they can't add that. Or if 
its not in the statue, they can add that. Seems to me if it was the 
latter, then they could add whatever restrictions they wanted and that 
would go against the spirit of the law. Is the indemnification clause 
something that is just generically added to many documents that are 
produced by the city?

The point is that the cities public records laws are governed by the 
province's public records laws and they can't just add things they feel 
like. And if they do and it clearly doesn't square with the law, it can 
be ignored.

If its not so clear, then I suppose clarification from the city is the 
best option. A small team of lawyers to help with clarification would be 
nice.  Does OSM have any legal volunteers that help out with these issues?


On 7/19/2016 7:32 AM, James wrote:
> If Calgary is able to change to the open gov license v.2 
> (http://open.canada.ca/en/open-government-licence-canada) it would be 
> compatible with openstreetmap, but until then the chance of getting 
> sued and the specific clause against possible illegal activities 
> (which would invalidate our license agreement) prevent us from 
> importing the data
> /EndOfDiscussion
> On Jul 19, 2016 7:24 AM, "Greg Troxel" <gdt at ir.bbn.com 
> <mailto:gdt at ir.bbn.com>> wrote:
>     >
> > >
> >
> > James <james2432 at gmail.com <mailto:james2432 at gmail.com>> writes:
> >
> > > To the fullest extent permitted by law, you shall indemnify and save
> > > harmless The City, from any claim, loss, damage, injury or 
> liability of any
> > > kind, nature and description (including, without limitation, 
> incidental and
> > > consequential damages, court costs, attorney’s fees and costs of
> > > investigation), that arise directly or indirectly, in whole or in 
> part,
> > > from your use of the Data, including without limitation your use 
> of the
> > > Data in a Derivative Work. In addition to your obligation to 
> indemnify The
> > > City, you specifically acknowledge and agree that you have an 
> immediate and
> > > independent obligation to defend The City from any claim which 
> actually or
> > > potentially falls within this indemnification provision, even if the
> > > allegations are or may be groundless, false or fraudulent, which 
> obligation
> > > arises at the time such claim is tendered to you by The City and 
> continues
> > > at all times thereafter. THE CITY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR ANY 
> >
> > I agree that an indemnification clause is totally unacceptable.  Until
> > that's fixed, the rest of the discussion is just an excuse for nerds to
> > argue :-)
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