[OSM-legal-talk] Fwd: OSM (Open Street Map) Creative Commons Licence 2.5 (CCL) versus GeoBase Unrestricted Use Licence Agreement (GeoBase licence)

Nick Black nickblack1 at gmail.com
Mon Apr 7 20:12:12 BST 2008


Hello,

I've been involved in some ongoing dialogue with Natural Resources,
Government of Canada, who are keen for their National Road Network to
be used by OSM.  There are a few particularities of the license that
need clarifying on OSM's party. Natural Resources are happy that OSM's
current cc-by-sa license is fully compatible with their own licensing.
 I would appreciate input from the community here - do we agree with
Natural Resources' interpretation of the license?  If not can we give
them some constructive feedback regarding their own license?  If so,
I'll move ahead with getting the data imported.

See email below:

Cheers,



---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Séguin, Claude <cseguin at nrcan.gc.ca>
Date: Mon, Apr 7, 2008 at 8:19 PM
Subject: RE: OSM (Open Street Map) Creative Commons Licence 2.5 (CCL)
versus GeoBase Unrestricted Use Licence Agreement (GeoBase licence)
To: nickblack1 at gmail.com
Cc: flevin at mac.com, michael.mather at sympatico.ca, tom.hammond at iucn.org,
OSM at weait.net


Good day Mr Black,

 Any news or comments following or answers to questions in regards of
OSM Creative Commons Licence versus GeoBAse Unrestricted User
Licence??



 Claude Séguin
 Coordonnateur CITS Propriété Intellectuelle /CTIS Intellectual
property coordinator
 Centre d'information topographique (CITS) / Centre for Topographic
Information (CTIS)
 Ressources naturelles, Gouvernement du Canada / Natural Resources,
Government of Canada
 2144, rue King Ouest, bureau 010/2144, King Street West, suite 010,
 Sherbrooke, (Québec), J1J 2E8
 Téléphone/Phone: (819) 564-5600 poste/ext. : 231
 Courrier électronique/E-Mail : cseguin at RNCan.gc.ca
 Équipe soutien aux usagers/Customer support group
 1-800-661-2638 (Canada et É.-U.) / (Canada and U.S.)
 (819) 564-4857, Téléc. / Facsimile : (819) 564-5698
 bndt at rncan.gc.ca / ntdb at nrcan.gc.ca <mailto:ntdb at nrcan.gc.ca>
 www.cits.rncan.gc.ca / www.ctis.nrcan.gc.ca




 -----Original Message-----
 From: Nick Black [mailto:nickblack1 at gmail.com]
 Sent: 30 janvier, 2008 10:02
 To: Séguin, Claude
 Cc: flevin at mac.com; michael.mather at sympatico.ca;
tom.hammond at iucn.org; OSM at weait.net
 Subject: Re: OSM (Open Street Map) Creative Commons Licence 2.5 (CCL)
versus GeoBase Unrestricted Use Licence Agreement (GeoBase licence)

 Séguin,

 Many thanks for answering some of the concerns that the OSM community
has about the license.  I've passed on your email to the relevant
people within the OpenStreetMap Foundation who I'm sure will be
contacting you shortly - we are all very keen to get the GeoBase data
into OSM.

 Best,



 On Jan 30, 2008 2:41 PM, Séguin, Claude <cseguin at nrcan.gc.ca> wrote:
 >
 >
 >
 >
 > To:  Mr Nick Black
 >
 > Subject: 'Open Street Map Creative Commons Share Alike Licence'
 > versus compatibility of 'GeoBase Unrestricted Use Licence Agreement'
 > National Road Network data
 >
 > You have expressed concerns about the 'compatibility' between the
 > GeoBase Unrestricted Use Licence Agreement (GeoBase licence) and the
 > Creative Commons Share Alike 2.5 Licence (CCL) used for Open Street
Map (OSM).
 >
 > This being a matter of concern for GeoBase, since the main reason for
 > GeoBase is to provide data accessible as possible to users at no cost
 > and closest to the source as possible.
 >
 > Following a review of the GeoBase license versus CCL for OSM users, we
 > do not see any constraints that would prevent OSM users from
 > downloading National Road Network (NRN)  or any other type of  data
 > from the GeoBase portal and to use this data.
 >
 > We have found that the GeoBase licence is in some respects more 'User
 > permissive' than the CCL.
 >
 >
 > We have provided some comments below that should be of some assistance to
 > you.   Please note that this is Not a Legal Opinion and should you have any
 > particular legal concerns in respect of your rights and obligations
 > under the GeoBase license or the CCL, please contact your legal
 > advisor for assistance.
 >
 >
 >
 >
 > -1) Licence Grant (2.0)
 > In paragraph 2,  the agreement allows the Licensee to maintain IPRs
 > over any derivatives from the use of the data. This is also very
 > commendable, but not in the spirit of paragraph 1.
 >
 > Under section 2.1 of the GeoBase licence, the user receives broad
 > rights in respect of the data, such as the right to use, incorporate,
 > sublicense, modify, improve, further develop, distribute, manufacture
 > and distribute derivative products from the data.
 >
 > Under section 2.2, the intellectual property rights arising from any
 > modification, improvement, development, translation of data, or from
 > the manufacture of derivative products effected by or for the Licensee
 > will vest in the Licensee or in such person as the Licensee shall
 > decide.  It is up to the Licensee who made the modification or
 > improvement to the data to decide downstream distribution of its product.
 >
 >
 >
 >
 >
 > 2) Protection and acknowledgment of source (3.0)
 > - How would the sources be properly acknowledged?
 > The GeoBase licence requires that proper acknowledgement of data
 > source
 > GeoBase(R)  be provided where the data is distributed or contained in
 > derivative products.
 >
 > The acknowledgment of data source of GeoBase could be made in
 > different ways that OSM users would think best for them, provided the
 > acknowledgment is made clear.  For example, it could be made in a list
 > of possible data providers for OSM users.
 >
 >
 >
 > 3) Warranty, Liability, Indemnity (4.1, 4.2, 4.3) Liability clause
 > (4.0): Your license specifically contains such a clause.
 > The Open Street Map license does not contain any such provision The
 > Warranty and liability clauses in both licences are essentially
 > standard provisions. See sections 5.0 and 6.0 of the CCL.
 >
 >
 >
 >
 > 4) Warranty, Liability, Indemnity (4.4) -Liability/warranty clause
 > (4.4): the licensee shall license all individuals or companies who
 > obtain derivative products
 >
 >
 >
 > Under the CCL, the Licensee does not need to comply with section 4.4
 > found in the GeoBase licence when no sublicensing is involved.
 > Section 4 a. of the CCL states that "You may not sublicense the Work".
 > Section 4.4 of the GeoBase license is concerned with sublicensing
 > issues and is therefore not applicable to a user operating under a CCL
 > (no conflict) when no sublicensing is involved.
 >
 >
 >
 > 5) Term of Agreement (5.0)
 > Term (5.1): agreement effective for one year?? Why ??
 > CCL is perpetual (for the duration of the applicable copyright) where
 > as this does not appear to be the case for the GeoBase Licence
 > Although section 2.1 of the GeoBase licence does not include the word
 > "perpetual" in the Grant of Licence provision, sections 5.1 and 5.2 in
 > effect grant the Licensee the right to use etc. the Data (subject to
 > section
 > 6) in perpetuity as the initial one year term is subject to the
 > Agreement being automatically extended for successive one (1) year
 > terms.  Section 6 provides that the Agreement may only be terminated
 > in the event that (a) the Licensee is in breach of its obligations
 > under the Agreement, (b) the Licensee terminates the Agreement by 30
 > days notice in writing to Canada or
 > (c) the parties terminate the Agreement by mutual consent.
 >
 > It should be noted that pursuant to section 7a. of the CCL, the CCL
 > will also terminate automatically upon any breach by the Licensee of
 > the terms of the CCL.  Hence, although different wording is used in
 > the grant of licence provisions of the GeoBase licence and the CCL,
 > the net effect seems to be the same.
 >
 >
 >
 > 6) Termination (6.0)
 > Termination Clause: section (s.6.3) of the Agreement and its potential
 > to require the removal, delete the data that has since been modified
 > or derive product There is no "Stop Use" of Work provision in the CCL.
 > Section 6.3 of the GeoBase licence does include a stop of use etc.
 > provision in the Agreement.
 > However, this provision will not apply unless the Agreement is
 > terminated in accordance with section 6.1.  It is solely within the
 > power of the Licensee to avoid the application of section 6.3 and that
 > the inclusion of section
 > 6.3 in the GeoBase licence does not necessarily make that Agreement
 > incompatible with the CCL.
 >
 > Right of Termination
 > Under the GeoBase licence, the Agreement cannot be terminated by
 > Canada at Canada's sole discretion.  Section 6.1 sets out the
grounds for termination.
 > The CCL also includes the right of termination for non-compliance with
 > the terms and conditions of the CCL.  Hence, in this respect, neither
 > the GeoBase licence nor the CCL is more onerous than the other.
 >
 >
 >
 > 7) Applicable Law
 >
 > Under section 7.1 of the GeoBase licence, the Agreement is be
 > construed and enforced in accordance with the laws in force in the
province of Ontario.
 > In the CCL, the applicable law provision is set out in clause 8(g) -
 > The validity and performance of this licence will be governed by the
 > laws in force in Canada, where applicable, those of the province in
 > which the Licensor normally resides.
 >
 > We do not see this as an issue.  For questions concerning the
 > interpretation/enforceability of the provisions of the GeoBase
 > licence, the applicable laws of Ontario and Canada will be applied by
 > the court whereas for questions concerning the interpretation and
 > enforceability of the CCL the laws in force in Canada, where
 > applicable, and those of the province in which the Licensor
normally resides will be applied by the court.
 >
 >
 >  We hope these clarifications will help you to better understand our
 > GeoBase Unrestricted Use Licence Agreement and encourage you to access
 > the National Road Network from GeoBase.
 >
 >
 >
 >
 > Claude Séguin
 > Coordonnateur CITS Propriété Intellectuelle /CTIS Intellectual
 > property coordinator Centre d'information topographique (CITS) /
 > Centre for Topographic Information (CTIS) Ressources naturelles,
 > Gouvernement du Canada / Natural Resources, Government of Canada 2144,
 > rue King Ouest, bureau 010/2144, King Street West, suite 010,
 > Sherbrooke, (Québec), J1J 2E8 Courrier électronique/E-Mail :
 > cseguin at RNCan.gc.ca
 >
 >
 >
 >
 >
 >



 --
 Nick Black
 --------------------------------
 http://www.blacksworld.net



-- 
Nick Black
--------------------------------
http://www.blacksworld.net




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